DAMN!
Most exciting quarter of basketball for this team all season and Iguodala and Brand were squarely planted on the bench.
I am torn right now just a little bit. I am in no way about moral victories especially when this is the third straight loss and against a 3-9 opponent. But we saw some great things from the rook, Lou (offensively of course), Sam and Thad.
I am just going to hit some points quickly and we can discuss in the comments.
When Lou is making jumpers he is extremely tough to deal with and more than any player on this roster can carry the team offensively similar to the way A.I. use to. That means exciting stretches of drives, floaters, steals and jumpers in rapid fire fashion. Look it’s well established the kid is allergic to defense. That’s not changing – ever. So we just gotta take the good with the horrible while he is still playing for the Sixers. And his good was really good tonight offensively.
I wish Lou would have drove to the cup on that last shot. I hate when guys settle for that deep step back deuce to win the game. Attack give yourself 3 ways to make a winning play.
Did you all noticed Thad played 42 minutes? I didn’t. He has the quietest 23 points on earth. Nothing memorable at all. Just made baskets. 10-19 from the field.
Andre Iguodala sucks! Look, dude can be productive and he just had a bad game, but he had a bad game because he allowed it to happen. He settled for college three, after college three after college three. I have no idea what goes through this dudes head on offense. He had Nick Young defending him most of the night and he let him off the hook by taking low percentage jumpers. Just no idea where his head was tonight. Up his ass is probably a good guess.
Elton Brand strained hamstring. We can fully expect him to look like the Brand we have come to loathe. You know the one that can’t dunk, can’t shoot, can’t rebound, can’t defend, can’t run but can spend his over priced salary. If his arm got hurt or something like that I wouldn’t feel like this. But ANY pain or injury to his lower body is guaranteed to kill any hope of productivity coming from him. Sigh.
I don’t buy the Jason Smith hype train. Sorry. Yes he brings energy I don’t doubt that. But so did Reggie Evans and people quickly grew tired of him and Smith as far from being the tough guy this team needs. 3 boards in 28 minutes should bother every Jason Smith man crush out there. If he is going to be on the floor the one thing he MUST do is rebound the ball and so far this season he has been nothing short of a kitten on the glass. If that changes I’ll adjust my tune.
Sure I appreciate the effort, the 2 blocks and the 5-6 from the line (NOT the ill-advised threes though). But every time Sam went to block a shot it was Smith’s responsibility to cover the back side boards when a shot was missed and he was no where to be found. NO ONE was there to be found. This has been happening for years. Sam goes to block and alter shots and everyone just stands and watches. The other team grabs the board – easy second chance basket. I like Smith just not as much as everyone else.
Easily Sammy’s best game of the season. He made his open 15 footers, he rebounded and he was all over the place defensively. Need that effort Sam. Bring that and you will get your 30 minutes. It’s that simple. We get blown out if Sam doesn’t play as well as he did tonight.
Player of the game is Jrue Holiday. If not for his made shots, defense, rebounding and infectious energy this game would have been a laugher. 11 points, 4-6 from the field, 3-5 from three, 6 boards, 2 steals and a block in only 10 fourth quarter minutes. And in actuality it was probably done in like a 5 minute span of time.
Couple things about Jrue who showed 5 important things…
- No fear. Dude game in and attacked. He looked for his shot as and put it up with confidence. That is major for the rook and hopefully that confidence he has in himself will gain him confidence from the coach and teammates.
- Fight. He got in with the Sixers down 15 and took it upon himself to dig the Sixers out of that hole. And he did it on both ends of the floor and on the boards. He showed the potential the impact the game in every way possible.
- His defensive prowess is NOT hype. He picks up his man hard at least at half court every possession and works him. It will be a complete pleasure to watch him hound opposing guards all game. He has the potential to lock up and force turnovers on opposing ball-handlers single-handily. He had a great block on Jamison with 3:30 left and the Sixers down 6. If he doesn’t get that Jamison makes one his scoop shots and I think the game is over. That block AND the hustle offensive rebound Jrue got lead to the made three by Lou that cut the lead to 3. That is a 5 point turn-around and a play that SHOULD NOT go unnoticed.
- Board work. He has the potential to be Jason Kidd like on the boards. He attacks the glass and uses his size well to pull down boards on both ends.
- Vision and passing. This is premature but the one pick and roll he ran with Jason Smith was flawless. He threaded the needle with a perfect pass to Smith for easy lay-up. Something to get excited about.
The ONLY silver lining from this loss will come if Jrue starts to see consistent minutes EVER game. Eddie don’t be stupid, play the kid. There is absolutely no reason for Ivey to play at all. And the back court of Jrue and Lou was strong to finish the game.
That’s enough positive because the fact of the matter the Sixers played ANOTHER bad game. They played absolutely not defense through 3 quarters. Thad still can’t guard anyone or box out anyone. Lou still can’t defend anyone. No one rotates to open shooters and they watch as shots go up so if a team happens to miss they end up with the offensive rebound often.
I have no idea why this team only decides to play hard or the way they are capable of for VERY short stretches.
107-108 loss to the Wizards in a game the Sixers really needed to stop the bleeding. Three straight losses going into…
Boston tomorrow, Atlanta Friday (Pete and I will be at that one), Spurs Sunday and Dallas Monday. That is a horrid stretch and I fully expect the Sixers to lose all those games. That means you’re looking at a 5-13 record. Ugh
Back at it tomorrow night.
{ 19 comments… read them below or add one }
Dannie, the last 3 games, in spite of the losses, have been enjoyable to watch. For some reason I expect a good run sooner rather than later and a step up in competition may bring that about. If Elton is out , who starts for YOU ? As far as Lou, he is becoming an efficient scorer that gets to the line, and unlike the rest of this group, seems to make them. If I had to bet who was going to be the 2o ppg. scorer this team needs, to go along with Iggy it is a tossup right now between Lou and Thad.
I disagree. The made 3 to bring them within 2 with 1:35 left to play? The 5 straight points he scored (jumper, steal, and-1 layup) to bring them within 10 to end the 3rd (which paved the way for the 4th quarter comeback, they had been down 15 with 44 seconds left in the 3rd).
Dannie – I thought the same thing when I saw Thad’s box score: “23, really? My god that was a quiet 23 points.”
Jrue / Lou combo – I’d like to see this some more in short stretches when we are desparate for a bucket. If you throw those two in the backcourt, and Iggy/Thad or Carney/Thad at SF/PF, that gives you a pretty fascinating small ball look that most teams would have trouble stopping.
Jrue – As I stated in the other thread, it was awesome to watch Jrue have an offensive explosion and single handedly put us back into the game. As Dannie wrote in his post, he excels in defense, plays without fear and acts like he belongs, and can board it up. But I will point out again that the single most important thing for we Sixer fans to really look out for with him is his PG abilities. Not offensive production…but PG skill.
Nate Robinson, Nick Young, Marcus Thornton, Aaron Brooks, Anthony Morrow, Jose Juan Barea, Will Bynum…these are all more recent guards to have entered the league and their first year, or finally got some PT, and showed a surprising ability to enter games and put up points or stats numbers in a flurry. Yet for many of them, their long term projection faded quickly or is uncertain because once people get over the “shock value” of them having a decent talent level, people look for their games to expand and where/how they will fit long term with a team, and things don’t add up.
So what I’m concerned with Jrue’s game that we should be watching out for:
-Can he display leadership skills even at this young age?
-Can he pass…like, REALLY pass, regularly and consistently in a half court offense?
-Is he going to be a little bitch and whine and mope everytime something bad happens (Iguodala, Andre)?
-Will Jrue PUSH it up the floor or look for the immediate outlet pass to lead a break with wreckless abandon, or “ho hum” it too much?
-Can Jrue have the type of eye to thread the needle REGULARLY like he did with that one beautiful play Dannie alluded to in his post?
-Is Jrue a TRUE pass first PG, or PG that will always looked to get others involved, or is he a scoring point that goes for his own shot first?
-Will he show good shot selection, and a good instinct for when to push/attack in order to get teammates involved, vs. times when the team will need him to try and score?
-Can he do the “little PG things”…come off high screens with precision, make non-sloppy, non-lazy passes, pass into the post safely, keep his defender honest by testing the waters of driving and then pulling back, change speeds during a drive?
-What level of court vision, in a full court transition and half court offense, does Jrue have?
These are the kind of things I want to know about him. Props to the guy if he can be an Andrew Toney like assassin, but those are the same things we said about Lou Williams once we started to see his game blossom. We need Jrue to be our future PG…our LONG TERM answer at PG. If he shows the ability to finish that Jason Smith play as a regular trait of his…AND plays defense to the level we’ve seen…AND shows that “fight” Dannie mentioned…we’ve got ourselves a baller. But until I see the PG traits emerged, jury’s out for me, and I’m not going to get too excited.
P.S: The one thing Jrue did show which is really impressive, one of those intangibles you cant help but get excited about: He made it look easy. The game came naturally to him, and it looked effortless. That’s a rare quality, and I hope we see more of this as his minutes increase.
What the hell is wrong with Andre. 3 absolutely horrible games in a row. Dude needs to snap out of it. The last 3 games were winnable if he has a decent game. But poor shooting, and bad decision making has been killing him. I think Jordan should cut down on his minutes a little bit so hopefully when he’s in there, he’s giving it his all and being aggresive. I know his minutes aren’t that much higher this year than his career average… but he’s having to do a lot more.
DaveT., When he was drafted the main quotes I remember our G.M. using was a pass first p.g. , that defends, and has great character. And he went on to compare him to Thad and called him a good kid. I can!t let one season playing out of position in college take away the 3 state titles his high school won and the fact he was a top 3 high school player. I read recently he would have been a top 5 pick out of H.S. if the rules hadn!t changed. I just don!t get all the doubts, why can!t he become a stud? Not being allowed to develop in college doesn!t help but other guys, with high character get over that. The one thing our G.M. does is draft well so I have faith he WILL be a stud, and maybe sooner than we think. And that pass to Jason was, to me, the high light of his night. Guest, Iggy looked to me like he was left out of the party and our coach sat him because of it. He better be able to handle the fact that there may be more natural scorers ready to emerge on this team and take the big shots. If Elton is back , and Lou and Thad keep developing maybe Iggy can get back to filling the box score and defending, his two greatest traits.
Suede – I’d start Jrue. What the hell. This team isn’t good no matter how you look at it or who you put on the floor. I would fully expect them to get destroyed by Boston (anyone) by going small like that but they can’t possibly be playing for “now.”
Get the rook in the game and see what you have. Start his on-the-job development asap.
Lou’s playing at a high level offensively so his stock has to be pretty solid right now. If an offer comes in that makes sense I would trade him. If that happens it would be good to have a bunch of games under the kids belt before hand.
Suede – I don’t think that anyone’s saying Jrue can’t be a stud, I think it’s more we just don’t know, and don’t have much to go off of. We basically have to treat his one year at UCLA like it never happened because he played out of position, and unless someone on Recliner is a HUGE Jrue fan, I don’t think any of us have access to his full 25+ game season at high school. This means we are honestly only judging the kid off of the spotty minutes he’s getting under EJ so far.
Also…Ed has drafted well? He’s only had two picks…one was awesome (Speights) the other I’d give a 4.5/10 in Jason Smith. And I don’t think any fan should be trusting what their GM says…it’s up to us to use our own eyes and trust what we’ve seen from a player in college. Unfortunately, Jrue is a weird situation where we can’t do that.
I like what you said about Iguodala…he’s not a “natural” scorer. Couldn’t be more true. He’s the definition of a guy that looks like he’s always working too hard for his shots…and unlike a guy like, say, Antawn Jamison or Manu Ginobili…with Iggy that’s not a good thing. If we could get him back to playing the defense he did his first two years though…man. I think all of us would throw a party. But he clearly caught Richard Jefferson syndrome.
I guess I am going to be in the minority with this opinion but I need to get it out. From my youth I have been a HUGE Sixers fan (like everyone on this site) and as I watched last night’s game I was watching as a Wizards fan. Not that I AM a fan of Washington…but I NEED the sixers to tank…and last night is the type of loss that I think we NEED. I am so sick and tired of getting a #12-#18 draft pick, losing in the first round of the playoffs, and sitting in an empty arena week after week. The Sixers need to LOSE…and lose, and lose. This needs to be blown up completly. From GM to coach to players. I want a LOTTERY pick…a TOP 5 pick…and then hope that our talent evaluators can figure this whole mess out. We MUST start fresh next year….coach, players, GM..whatever it takes! I look forwward to the next 5 games and hope that it results in 5 more loses…and if YOU really want to see a MAJOR change next year you will be hoping for the same.
krazykevy, I think your wish will come true because of coach EJ and this organization (what are you guys doing, what’s the damn plan). This team is gonna flirt with making the 8th seed but ultimately because of coach EJ we’re gonna lose it and be in the lottery.
But we’re in the wrong conference for tanking, we’re only 1 1/2 games from the 8th spot, and the two teams in front of us are Indiana and Detroit. I can’t believe Milwaukee’s the 5th seed. And I can’t believe the Knicks could have had a backcourt of Eric Gordon and Brandon Jennings right now. So krazykevy, the GM has to know what he’s doing, too – who do you want, by the way?
Zack – Why exactly do you think we are going to flirt with the 8th seed?
I fully expect to be 5-13 by next Tuesday. Speights will still be out. Who knows how Brand will play now that he has another lower extremity issue.
And at this point looking at the schedule for easy games is pointless since the Sixers are clearly the “mark” on everyone’s schedule.
When you play defense as poorly as the Sixers do every time has to be licking their chops when it’s time to play the Sixers.
Dannie, right now, based on early trends, the 4 teams ahead of us – Toronto, Chicago, Indiana, Detroit – haven’t shown any signs of separating themselves from the pack and claiming a foothold on the 7th and 8th seeds. Toronto no defense, Chicago bad coach, Indiana needs talent, Detroit no chemistry. I’d lump us in with Chicago, bad coach (though I’m no expert on Del Negro) on team with talent. I wouldn’t be surprised if Milwaukee joined this mediocre group once more scouting is done on Brandon Jennings.
About Jason Smith, I’ll add this to his list of negatives – he really can’t post up, and it’s a mistake to give him the ball down low unless he clearly has a layup or dunk in front of him or he’s gonna get blocked; also, he’s a lazy passer, which is somewhat disappointing because he seems to have good court awareness. But for the life of me I can’t understand this team’s better play when he’s on the floor. Sure he doesn’t get the rebounds, but good defense comes before the rebounds, and that’s what the Sixers’ defense is when he’s on the floor – good, not great, but good. As to why, I’m not sure.
Last note – last night was the first significant minutes he’s had with Sam, let’s see them play together some more, eh?
Zack – You also must factor in to your “trends” whose been hurt for those teams…
Chicago – Healthy Derrick Rose (he started the season playing with an ankle sprain word is he is finally getting close to 100%), return of Tyrus Thomas
Detroit – Healthy Richard Hamilton and Tyshaun Prince (Detroit has lost their last 5 but both of these guys haven’t played)
Indiana – Return of Mike Dunleavy
Milwaukee – Return of Michael Redd came back in limited minutes last game. Return of Bogut in 2-4 weeks. Return of Luc Richard Mbah a Moute.
Toronto – Is similar to us, except they have Bosh and we have Brand and they have some guys that can shoot and we don’t. If the defense even’s out between us and them they win with better offense.
Those teams have been missing key players who will likely return for the second half of the season AND they still have been either on par with the Sixers or better.
On the other hand the Sixers have stunk while at 100% (before Speights went down) and will be without him for another month+.
What I see happening is the Sixers falling behind and the only way they will be flirting with a playoff berth is if they go on one of their ridiculously unpredictable runs where they win 15 of 18 games.
Per DaveT: My response in CAPS.
So what I’m concerned with Jrue’s game that we should be watching out for:
-Can he display leadership skills even at this young age?
HE DEFINITELY LED BY EXAMPLE LAST NIGHT. HE ALSO GAVE THE TEAM A BIG BOOST WITH HIS ENERGY ON BOTH ENDS. HE’S NOT SCARED AND IT SHOWS. WE’LL SEE IF THAT TRANSLATES INTO LEADERSHIP.
-Can he pass…like, REALLY pass, regularly and consistently in a half court offense?
IN HIS BRIEF NBA CAREER HE ALREADY LOOKS LIKE THE BEST PICK&ROLL PASSER ON THE ROSTER BY A WIDE MARGIN. HE ALSO HAS HIT OPEN SHOOTERS ON TIME. SO SIGNS POINT TO YES. WE’LL HAVE TO SEE HOW HE MANAGES AN OFFENSE DURING THE UPS AND DOWNS OF A GAME. HE HAS MADE SOME LAZY TO’S WITH PASSES AND BALL HANDLING- MOSTLY UNDERESTIMATING ATHLETICALLY THE OPPOSITION.
-Is he going to be a little bitch and whine and mope everytime something bad happens (Iguodala, Andre)?
I’VE SEEN NO SIGN OF THIS SO FAR, HAVE YOU?
-Will Jrue PUSH it up the floor or look for the immediate outlet pass to lead a break with wreckless abandon, or “ho hum” it too much?
ABSOLUTELY. HE’S DONE THIS EVERY TIME HE’S BEEN ON THE FLOOR AND IT IS HIS M.O.
-Can Jrue have the type of eye to thread the needle REGULARLY like he did with that one beautiful play Dannie alluded to in his post?
SEE ABOVE. SO FAR HIS PASSES HAVE BEEN ON TIME AND NOT ALWAYS FLASHY.
-Is Jrue a TRUE pass first PG, or PG that will always looked to get others involved, or is he a scoring point that goes for his own shot first? I READ HIS REP IN HS WAS A GUY WHO LIKES TO PENETRATE DEEP IN THE LANE WITH THE MAIN GOAL OF BREAKING DOWN THE DEFENSE FOR AN ASSIST. COMPARED IN STYLE TO HOW PAUL ATTACKS THE HEART OF THE D TO SET UP TEAMMATES. WE’LL SE IF HIS SIZE/HANDLE ALLOW HIM TO DO THIS AT AN NBA LEVEL. ELITE HS IS NO WHERE CLOSE TO THE NBA.
-Will he show good shot selection, and a good instinct for when to push/attack in order to get teammates involved, vs. times when the team will need him to try and score?
-Can he do the “little PG things”…come off high screens with precision, make non-sloppy, non-lazy passes, pass into the post safely, keep his defender honest by testing the waters of driving and then pulling back, change speeds during a drive?
GOOD QUESTION.
-What level of court vision, in a full court transition and half court offense, does Jrue have?
SEE ABOVE. I’D SAY HE IS ALREADY WELL AHEAD OF LOU IN THIS REGARD.
Sorry about the caps, felt it was the easiest way to respond to so many questions.
Thanks, wish I could preview my posts cause that one came out uglier than a Sixers’ game. I guess that will come w/reclinergm 2.0.
BTW, don’t want to come across as a Jrue fanboy. I have no idea if he will turn out to be just a role player or an impact player. At pick 17 its usually a crap shoot. Just wanted to pass along what I read about him. I also reviewed one UCLA game tape and watched all of the summer league I could, but did not see anything special from watching it.
If anything he’s looked better in his brief runs with the Sixers. His jumper is definitely better than advertised and has a much quicker release than Thad, and cleaner than Iguodala (which is not saying much.)
If I had to guess I’d say the Sixers will end up around the 9th worst record in the NBA. Gives them little hope of moving into the top 3 given the double weighted lottery, but should give them a shot at a top prospect if they go with BPA.
They are 27th right now in both Stein’s and Hollinger’s power rankings. Ugh.
The one thing that stood out to me was their strength of schedule.
So far the Sixers have played the 2nd weakest schedule through 14 games (gotta be heavily weighted by two Nets games). Weakest schedule was that of the Bucks.
Their opponents average winning percentage so far has been .429.
Zack that’s another trend for you to consider. The Sixers have had a cupcake start to the season and haven’t been able to capitalize on it. Things are about to get much tougher for them.
But they will make a late run… book it.
God help us if they make another late run….groundhog day all over again and mediocrity will continue to rule the sixers. So, tk I hope your crystal ball is malfunctioning…