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Pedro Martinez a Phillie? Is this a good thing?

by Pete on July 13, 2009

Pedro Phillies

UPDATE: Pedro has signed. $1 million guaranteed, $1.5 million in incentives. He will likely be put on the DL immediately, and start a minor league rehab program. Expect to see him in August.

Jon Heyman is saying it is inevitable, Jayson Stark says he’s flying to Philly as I type. The writing appears to be on the wall, and Pedro Martinez will likely be donning the red pinstripes in the next couple days. So the question is – is this a good thing? In order to answer that question, I think we need to ask some other questions…

  1. If Pedro can be helpful, why hasn’t anyone else signed him? It certainly appears the answer to this question is “money.” Pedro wanted a $5 million deal at the beginning of the year, and never backed down. He will likely take a pro-rated salary for a couple million, and the Phillies are one of only a few teams that have the ability to add payroll right now.
  2. What kind of effect will he have on the clubhouse? While Pedro isn’t a bad clubhouse guy, he is different than the guys we have now. He’s loud, playful and demands the media’s attention. Will this distract our players, or will it take some pressure off them with all eyes on Pedro? I’m not sure, but I do know Gillick never made a move that would change the dynamic of this clubhouse.
  3. What makes us think he’s better than Drew Carpenter, Carlos Carrasco or even Rodrigo Lopez? The Phillies have 3 viable options in the minors to take the 5th starter spot, but are instead choosing to put Pedro in that spot. They clearly think that Pedro can be better than those 3, and if he fails or gets hurt, they still have those guys to fall back on. The more the merrier, I guess.
  4. What can we expect from Pedro? He had a 5.61 ERA last year, but was injured for most of that time. I think the best case scenario would be that he can pitch how he did in 2006, with a 4.48 ERA and 1.11 WHIP. He claims that he feels as good as he has in awhile (of course he does) and he did look good in the WBC (6 scoreless innings for the Dominican) but I have some serious doubts as to whether he can keep up production over a full half-season.
  5. Is it bad that I’m excited? As you can see, I have my doubts about this, and I really don’t see this working out how Ruben thinks it will. Pedro might have thrown 91 in a 3 inning simulated game, but he won’t be doing that over several 6 inning starts. This might be like watching Livan Hernandez throw a bunch of junk at hitter every start with varying results. However, I can’t help but be somewhat optimistic. I mean, this is Pedro Martinez. One of the best pitchers of all time. The guy who had, in my opinion, the single greatest pitching season in baseball history in 2000. He’s a super-duper-star unlike anyone on our team even though he hasn’t pitched in about a year. Like the move or not, there is no way you are missing his first start in pinstripes.

Here’s what I think will happen

I think we sign Pedro this week, and he puts together a couple good starts since his arm is so fresh right now. Around mid-August, I think his age and wear will catch up to him and he’ll start getting hit around and/or hurt and Carpenter or Lopez will take his spot in the rotation. The Phillies clearly have the money right now, so I’m OK with them taking this risk, I just don’t see it working out. Either way, it’ll certainly be interesting for the fans, and we can always hope Pedro can reinvent himself and help our push towards the playoffs.

What do you guys think?

I’m sure everyone has an opinion on this. Let’s hear it.

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July 13, 2009

{ 1 trackback }

Advice to the Philadelphia Phillies: Say no to Pedro | Heard in the Cheap Seats
07.14.09 at 3:32 pm

{ 13 comments… read them below or add one }

1 Kenny 07.13.09 at 11:21 am

I really wanted them to make a move on halladay.. but the way i look at pedro is he either works or doesnt and either way he will be more consistant in the long run then guys like bastardo or lopez.. this guy knows what it takes to win.. and i dont think it necessarily rules out a halladay run either.. and the only reason i would be hesitant on halladay is giving away all our prospects so we got a veteran pitcher without losing any prospects i guess its better than sitting around and watching nothing happen. I will admit i didnt like the Raul signing.. we seen how that worked out.. so maybe this Pedro signing will be good … were getting a HOF pitcher for half a season.. lets not get frustrated and see how it works out

2 guest 07.13.09 at 11:28 am

It’s not necessarily a bad thing… but I don’t think it’s a very good thing either. I understand why you are excited… because this guy has the potential to help the Phillies tremendously.  If he can stay healthy and pitch close to what he did in 06 this move could help out big time.  You mentioned durability, How many starts are you expecting out of Pedro until the end of the season?  If they can limit his starts and keep him fresh than I think he has a chance to be effective.  What the Phillies can’t do is expect Pedro to be a great pitcher.  They can’t expect him to return to his “Red Sox” form.  They have to take it slow and try and see what they have before giving him a lot of starts.

P.s. I am not a Phillies fan so don’t take my opinion too seriously… I just think signing Pedro is an interesting move.

3 Pete 07.13.09 at 11:38 am

Kenny -

reports are this wont stop us from going after Halladay. In fact, if Pedro can stay effective, we could move Happ in a Halladay deal and still have a full 5 in our rotation.
4 Dan 07.13.09 at 11:51 am

Want to know why this signing is going to work for us? Because God hates the Mets this year. I fully expect Pedro to not only be an effective pitcher, but a good one (not great). I also expect him to be dominant against the Mets so God can laugh at their fans bitching and moaning

5 Drolz 07.13.09 at 1:25 pm

I think its worth a shot. Maybe Pedro could wind up being another Cory Lidle, Jamie Moyer, or Kyle Lohse. Nothing spectacular, but solid and good for several W’s down the stretch. Anything more than that would be a very pleasant surprise.

The one thing I’m not sure of anymore is a potential deal for Halladay. I keep changing my mind all the time. Am sure glad I’m not the GM. My worst nightmare is seeing Kyle Drabek winning the Cy Young and Michael Taylor winning the Triple Crown – in Blue Jays uniforms.

I know prospects are prospects and “potential” means they haven’t done anything at the big league level yet. And Halladay is clearly the real deal. But I still I think about all the blockbuster trades for stud pitchers that ultimately didn’t work out.

This makes me appreciate GillickBall even more. I’m guilty of saying “WTF?” when we acquired Blanton and Stairs while Milwaukee got Sabathia, and we all know how that turned out. So its the sum of all the parts on the entire team, not just the superstars, that wins championships.

I’m also concerned that even if Halladay improves our chances of winning one or two more championships in the short term, we may be ruining our chance to build a strong pitching rotation that could be together for *years.* I also feel confident that Taylor and Brown can help us maintain a winning tradition after Ibanez and Werth move on.

Can’t remember ever feeling this antsy before a trade deadline.

6 Pete 07.13.09 at 2:58 pm

Drolz -

I keep going back and forth as well. If I were Ruben, I think I would stand hard on Drabek being the 1 untouchable in the deal, with Happ a close 2nd, and then pretty much give him whoever they wanted. Including Jason Knapp. Something like Knapp, Carrasco, Brown or Taylor, Donald or Marson, Worley or Stutes or Flande or Carpenter
7 Pete 07.13.09 at 2:59 pm

I read a comment on Philly.com that I though summarized how I feel about this Pedro business…

I have no expectations other than failure but for some reason i’m intrigued..”
8 jurnee16 07.13.09 at 3:36 pm

Yeah Pete that is almost exactly I feel about Pedro I just couldn’t find the right words to comment….

And I would love it if the Blue Jays went for a deal that didn’t include Happ or Drabek like you suggested but I think that would be too good to be true…If we get Pedro and don’t include Happ in a deal for Halladay we would have one too many starters so I guess we would include Happ in the deal but I don’t want to give up both Happ and Drabek…I could live with Happ, Brown, Knapp, Donald, and Carrasco for Halladay I guess because I think Halladay puts us in the World Series in my opinion…If the Phillies do sign Pedro and pull off a deal for Halladay without giving up Happ who is taken out of the rotation?

9 Ryan F 07.13.09 at 5:24 pm

I am very excited.  I have always enjoyed the character that Pedro is.  I don’t think he will maintain the velocity with the fastball, but if he is in control of them and his off speed stuff is working, he can still contribute.

10 judas_priest 07.13.09 at 5:36 pm

He isn’t being asked to last a full half season – just over 2 months worth.  Don’t know if he can do it, but I think it’s worth the gamble.  I think he can make it into September, when we can use the minor leaguers we will have already  called up if he fades then.  I’m expecting an ERA of about 4.25-4.50.

11 Pete 07.14.09 at 12:03 pm

This is an interesting quote Ken Rosenthal got from a source…

“When people find out what the money is, they’re going to be surprised,” said one source with knowledge of the discussions. “It’s not about the money.”

12 phil the phan 07.15.09 at 11:01 am

I worry about clubhouse chemistry.  Since the Abreu dump, this team has been one cohesive unit without any egos, even with 4 superstars.  Look how quickly Backo fit in or how upset Taschner, Costie, even Pat Burrell were when they left.  I’m afraid with Pedro that camaraderie might take a hit.  To paraphrase Drolz, Gillickball is all about chemistry and chemistry + talent win championships.

13 Ryan F 07.16.09 at 5:35 pm

im really excited seeing pedro in a phills jersey, can’t wait to see how this works

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