1) Put me in the group that does not consider a changeup a breaking ball. Some people consider everything but a fastball a breaking ball, but there’s already a term for that…offspeed pitch.

2) I think a lot of Philly fan’s have some unrealistic expectations for Carrasco at this point. It’s understandable though, we’ve got a shallow farm system and a huge need for starting pitching. He’s the first place fans are going to look, despite the fact that he just turned 21 in March. I don’t think he’s ready this year, but give him another year or two and he will be a solid big leaguer. As a side note, it’s not that there hasn’t been interest in Carrasco. The Phils were unwilling to include him in trade talks up until recently.

a couple points on carrasco.

- do you consider a change-up a breaking pitch? (not trying to be snide, some people only count curves and sliders) His change-up is arguably his best pitch. He needs to develop a third pitch, but his change-up is above average.

- his ERA is 4.09, not exactly close to 5.

- he does walk too many, but not 1 per inning. He walks 0.39 per inning.

- If people think he is a Cole Hamels-level prospect, then they are wrong. But he is as good a prospect as Myers, Floyd, Wolf, etc…

- He’s only 21, so he’s pitching a above his age at double-A.

I think you need to read my post again…there was an implication made as to why the phillies may be able to swing a deal due to the fact that these particular prospects may not be as good, or as desireable as we would like to think here in Philadelphia. What I posted was a SAMPLE and never suggested that that sample was the whole truth concerning any particular prospect.

My opinion on Carrasco is that he doesn’t have a dominate enough fastball to allow him to have such below average breaking pitches. You can’t blow people away, let alone be effective with a 92 MPH fastball, and no breaking pitch to speak of. Yes, he is young, and developing but his continued lack of control is a concern– again, much of this due to the fact that he still throws across his body. His numbers at Double-A are confusing–one K, one hit, and one walk every inning pitched with and ERA close to 5–I just question that he truly is the prospect that people in this city thinks he is.

FOR: We DID trade two prospects for him, as you said; he’s got good stuff, good career numbers; J-Roll might get all jacked up again about picking him up, leading to better production from our shortstop; pitchers have recovered from injuries before and done well

AGAINST: a vast majority of Phillie fans HATE this guy, we’d want a move the fans will get behind, not one they’ll start trashing the first time he walks someone; if you have a bad experience one place, you usually don’t wanna go back there, I bet he’d be looking for a fresh start somewhere else; isn’t he a power pitcher, would he still be effective at his age and does his injury make him less effective as a result

“Carlos Carrasco. The best starting-pitcher prospect I saw, Carrasco threw fastballs at 90-93 and changeups about 10 mph slower, eschewing any breaking balls. He’s been rumored to be trade bait for the Phillies, who need starting pitching help. I’m not sure that Carrasco is much worse than the kinds of pitchers you can get back for him.”

isn’t it just as “uninformed” to make sweeping judgements on baseball players based on one game and one BP? The difference between a .275 hitter and a .300 hitter is 1 hit every 2 weeks. Not exactly something you can see in one game.

It’s true that our top prospects are not the same caliber as some others. But Marson is a 22 year old catcher, playing higher than he should (double-A) for that age, and has a .450 OBP, which is RIDICULOUS. He has little power, but will be a significant upgrade over our current catchers.

Golson has made strides this year for sure, but does still struggle with a lot of his game.

Carrasco did pretty well for having poor command, striking out 2 in a hitless inning. His issue is confidence. He’s not the caliber prospect of Hamels or Clay Bucholz, or Clayton Kershaw etc…, but he is a solid #2 type starter.

Donald is what he is. He’ll be a slightly above average SS in the league. Not sure he’s one of our “top” prospects. I think our top guys are Marson, Carrasco, Adrian Cardenas and Joe Savery (despite his early struggles).

A handful of players didn’t live up to advance billing. Lou Marson was fine behind the plate, but didn’t square balls up and repeatedly hit balls on the ground, even in BP. … Regular-season teammate Greg Golson showed again that his approach at the plate is atrocious, with a very long swing and poor pitch recognition, and he had two very bad reads in left field during the game. Carlos Carrasco was 90-94, throwing slightly across his body with poor command, and he didn’t throw a breaking ball in his inning of work.

Though, Jason Donald, a recent target of the Blue Jays, did get good reviews as a “hit for average” type hitter.

I think if we were willing to deal Carrasco we could pry Guthrie away from the O’s. Guthrie’s already 29, so I don’t really know how he fits in as a core of a rebuilding process, though I definately agree he’s their ace.