April 20, 2014

ReclinerGM 2009 NBA Mock Draft: Dannie vs. Pete, 1.0

OK – we are going to try something new here and do a combined mock draft, with each of us alternating and selecting players based on how WE would pick if we were GM’s. This is not a prediction of how the draft WILL go, rather how the draft WOULD go if WE ran the teams.

We will update this as we get to it, feel free to chime in as we move along (click-thru to see where we are)

1. Los Angeles Clippers (Pete): Blake Griffin, PF, Oklahoma

This is easy. Best player by a long shot. Eric Gordon, Al Thornton and Blake Griffin will give the Clippers a great core of young players, whose careers they can ruin.

2. Memphis Grizzlies (Dannie): Hasheem Thabeet, C, Connecticut

I guess this pick is going against grain a little bit in two ways.

  1. I don’t really like Thabeet a ton personally and
  2. Rubio is the sexy pick at #2 for most people (although I think he is more hype than substance at this point).

But I think Mike Conley started to show some signs last season that he can be the Grizzlies long-term answer at the point.  He increased his number in every statistical category including shooting 40% from three on 217 attempts.  Furthermore I think Memphis gets better faster and with a longer lasting effect by solidifying their front court with Thabeet at center and Gasol at PF.  You have a strong rebounding front line, a defensive center to protect the basket and a solid offensive, back to the basket power forward to go along with Mayo and Gay on the perimeter.  Also with Mayo and Gay I don’t think they needs a player that needs offensive touches and Thabeet fits the bill there.

3. Oklahoma City Thunder (Pete): Ricky Rubio, PG, Spain

This is a tough pick for me. Sure, you could move Russell Westbrook to SG and play Rubio at the point, but that will give you one of the worst, if not the worst, shooting backcourts in the NBA. I know Durant can shoot, but you need some help in the back court. The other option here would be Jordan Hill. Hill would fill a huge need for Oklahoma City, and could prove to be a solid NBA player, but would be a reach here. The Thunder are young enough that you really have to go with the best available player at this point, and Rubio is that player. If nothing else, he’ll be a great passer and defender. He’s got a chance to be what Shaun Livingston could have been if not for injury.

4. Sacramento Kings (Dannie): Jordan Hill, PF, Arizona

Sucks to be a Kings fan right about now.  They missed out on Blake Griffin considered to be a more athletic version of Karl Malone and franchise player.  Then they dropped out of the top 3 which is exaclty where they needed to be to get the impact player at point they need without it becoming a reach.  They also have a need for a starting small forward and front court depth and toughness.  Jordan Hill has potential but I hate using that as the sole reason for a pick.  What Hill can do is step right in and help their league worst defensive rating and 29th ranked defensive rebounding right away.  Not to mention the Kings have the 23rd and 30th pick to grab a point guard in a draft heavy with them.

5. Washington Wizards (Pete): Stephen Curry, PG/SG, Davidson

Here’s the first curveball. Most experts will have James Harden here, but this is my mock draft, and I think James Harden is wildly overrated. In Chad Ford’s most recent scouting analysis, he says Harden “won’t necessarily wow you with his athleticism. He’s not the tallest guard at his position. He doesn’t have a “SportsCenter” highlight reel. But he’s sneaky.” Add this to the most passive performance by a star in the NCAA’s I’ve seen in awhile (3 for 18, 19 points, in 2 games), and I’ll pass, thanks. Instead, I’ll take Curry, who when put in a backcourt with Gilbert Arenas, gives them 2 of the best shooters in the league, both of whom can play PG or SG. Curry scored 28 ppg while being double and triple teamed, and will see a lot of open shots with Arenas, Butler and Jamison getting the attention. Curry proved this year he can adapt his game and be a distributor as well if he needs to be, with 5.6 apg (Bob Knight even called him “the best passer I’ve ever seen in college,” which is weird and incorrect, but high praise nonetheless). He’s a smart dedicated kid who will scare off some GMs because of his size and baby-looks, but I think he’s one of few sure-things in this draft.

6. Minnesota Timberwolves (Dannie): James Harden, SG, Arizona State

Pete’s “curveball” screwed me a little bit because I was leaning heavily on taking Curry with this pick.  The Wolves were 24th in the NBA in 3pt shooting, need a point guard and surrounding Jefferson and Love in the post with Miller and Curry  sounds like a good idea to me.

With that whining out the way it’s clear Minnesota is only set in the front court at this point with Mike Miller in the last year of his contract.  So I take James Harden who disappointed me in the tournament but I am not as low on as Pete.  Word is he lost some weight and is working hard on his athleticism and jumper.  I think he is going to be good, how good depends on how he uses the growing criticism as fuel to prove everyone wrong.  But this also gives me a bunch of options.  I can play him at the two and move, Miller (6-8, decent rebounder) to the SF.  I can use Miller’s coveted shooting ability and expiring contract to improve my team long-term or I could get really creative and see if Harden can parlay his high basketball IQ to playing a big point guard which he did some of in college.

7. Golden State Warriors (Pete): Brandon Jennings, PG, USA

The Warriors really need a PG, and there are lots here to choose from, including Jennings, Johnny Flynn and Ty Lawson. I’ll take Jennings, who is a little underrated right now because he didn’t quite get the PT he thought he’d get in Europe. I’ll let Draft Express’ Jonathan Givony explain what he saw in a recent visit to Italy:

Pitted against one of the best defenders in Europe in American guard Ibi Jaaber, Jennings gets to wherever he wants on the court, showing blazing speed, outstanding ball-handling skills, incredible creativity and a real flair for making flashy plays.

Could make for an exciting backcourt with Monta Ellis.

8. New York Knicks (Dannie): Ty Lawson, PG, UNC

No Steph Curry so the Knicks have to go in a different direction.  I think the sure pick and perfect style player for this team is Ty Lawson.  He is arguably the quickest guard in the draft which fits perfect with D’Antoni’s 7 seconds or less offense.  Ty is easily the best point guard in transition and takes care of the ball extremely well.  I watched most of his games at UNC he is the real deal, a leader a winner and tough.  Questions about his shooting should go away, he increased his shooting %’s in each season and among the top points in this class he scored more efficiently than them all overall.  Ty is pass-first and a very good complimentary scorer and adequate shooter.  He should flourish in this “don’t touch anyone” NBA and has the perfect set of skills to run Mike D’Antoni’s offense.  All that is enough to look past his stature.

9. Toronto Raptors (Pete): Tyreke Evans, PG/SG, Memphis

This is a team in trouble. Chris Bosh wants out, Anthony Parker and Shawn Marion are leaving and their second best player might be Andrea Bargnani. I’m going with the best player available, and in my opinion, that is Tyreke Evans. Evans was the best player on Memphis as a freshman, and led his team to the Sweet 16 while winning National Freshman of the Year. He can get to the basket and is creative scorer, something that Toronto doesn’t have right now. Could end up as a steal at #9.

10. Milwaukee Bucks (Dannie): Jrue Holiday, PG, UCLA

This pick no matter what has to be point guard or power forward.  Ramon Sessions  is a restricted free agent and probably played his way into a full mid-level deal next season as a promising 23-year-old point guard.  Charlie Villanueva is an URF as well and had the best season of his career.  Word is they like both but probably can’t afford to sign them both.

I picked Jrue Holiday not because I love him as a prospect but with the expectation and higher likelihood teams will go after Sessions with a deal we can’t match more so then Villanueva.  Holiday has great size and is a lockdown defender and penetrator who Skiles would love next to Michael Redd.  This is the perfect fit since he won’t be called on to score much which would expose is weak jumper and underdeveloped offensive versatility.

11. New Jersey Nets (Pete): DeJuan Blair, PF, Pitt

Blair, and his freakish 7’3” wingspan, would make a good pairing with Brook Lopez in the front court for the Nets. Blair is an elite rebounder and his length will make up for his height in the NBA. At this point in a weak, PG-heavy draft I would really be looking for a solid role player, and I think Blair has excellent chance to be at least that. Everytime I watched him, I was impressed with his anticipation on offensive rebounds, something that is very valuable and very hard to teach.

12. Charlotte Bobcats (Dannie): Wayne Ellington, SG, UNC

This is a tough one.  The Bobcats have a clear need at shooting guard.  But they don’t need another Gerald Wallace type athlete at that position and the best 2-guards are exactly that (Henderson and Williams).  So I go in another direction and take another one of my favorite players Wayne Ellington here.  Stretch?  Sure but there are legit reasons for it.

Bobcats need a shooter at this position and Ellington is probably the best of the bunch.  They have Raja Bell on the roster for one more year and I think Wayne can learn a lot and develop into that type of player (shooter/defender) in the NBA.  The Larry Brown/Michael Jordan UNC tie makes this look less of a stretch.  This season I thought Wayne improved in 2 major areas: defense and creating his shot off the bounce.  He displayed his full compliment of skills with a fantastic tournament as well so his improved play will be fresh in people’s mind.

13. Indiana Pacers (Pete): Johnny Flynn, PG, Syracuse

I thought about taking a flyer on Demar DeRozen here, but with T.J. Ford often injured, and Jarrett Jack a free agent, Flynn is actually a good pick-up at this point. He’s quick, confident and can shoot a little. I’d say he’s Sebastian Telfair with a better jump-shot, which isn’t saying much, but will get him into an NBA rotation.

14. Phoenix Suns (Dannie): Earl Clark, SF/PF, Louisville

This is an easy pick.  You’ve probably already heard the Shawn Marion comparisons but I think he actually has more offensive talent and it’s clear Phoenix has abandoned their short stint at trying to play more defense and at a slower pace by firing Terry Porter.  Clark can run the floor, play multiple positions and pass like Boris Diaw and if he were to ever put in the work to reach his potential he could be an all-star.  He has that kind of talent.

15. Detroit Pistons (Pete): Gerald Henderson, SF, Duke

Yes, I know they have Prince and Hamilton and could use more help in the front court, but if I’m Joe Dumars, I know that this team is about to be completely blown-up and I just need to get good basketball players. Henderson showed an improved jump shot and improved offensive game to go with his freakish athleticism. At the absolute worst, he’s a better version of Dahntay Jones.

16. Chicago Bulls (Dannie): James Johnson, PF, Wake Forest

I am assuming Ben Gordon is resigned here.  Ideally the Bulls would want a banger, rebounder with some back to the basket post skills.  Johnson is a decent rebounder and has a developing post game and face-up mid-range game and can run with Derrick Rose.  With Miller and Tim Thomas both in the last year of their deals and unlikely to be resigned adding a young front court player is the pick for now.

17. Philadelphia 76ers (Pete): Eric Maynor, PG, VCU

Maynor is the slam dunk pick here for me if Lawson or Flynn don’t drop. He’s quick, smart, has good size and can shoot the ball. He can also come in and start right away in place of the (hopefully) departed Andre Miller. I loved him in college and both Dannie and I saw him in person against UCLA this year and he played very well against 2 good defenders in Darren Collison and Jrue Holliday. He’s not a star, but can be a real solid game manager who can score 10-12 points a game.

However, if Demar DeRozen were to drop here, you’d have to give him a look. We need a SG as well, and his ability has drawn comparisons to Tracy McGrady. But, if I’m GM, the PG is far more important and I’m not interested in a project.

I would also consider Nick Calathes, depending on how he works out.

18. Minnesota Timberwolves (Dannie): Demar DeRozen, SG/SF, USC

Can’t pass on talent like this at this spot.  In fact some draft boards have the Wolves taking him with their first pick in the draft to fill a need at small forward.   He will come in and compete immediately for time with Gomes and Brewer at the three.  If the draft actually went this way and the Wolves could get two strong wing players like with with their first two picks and point guards still on the board for their next pick I think their fans would be ecstatic.

19. Atlanta Hawks (Pete): Nick Calathes, PG, Florida

Doesn’t quite make up for passing on Chris Paul and Deron Williams, but with Mike Bibby possibly on his way out, Calathes might be a good fit. Jeff Teague is a better shooter, but Calathes is plenty good in that category and a far better passer. If Calathes can show good quickness and penetration skills, he will move up my draft board and perhaps give Eric Maynor a challenge at #17.

20. Utah Jazz (Dannie): Tyler Hansbrough, PF, UNC

He is going to be drafted in the first round by someone, might as well be Utah right? [insert a Utah and white basketball player joke here (see comment section)] I love Hansbrough.  He played hard and got the job done in a historical way as a college baskeball player.  All the concerns about him are legit though.  He needs to measure out well in terms of his height and wingspan.  He needs to show some athleticsm and lateral quickness during his workouts and combine.  There is no question he is strong as a horse, driven, tough and coachable.  Those things along with his developing face-up jumper and aggressive rebounding should be enough for Jerry Sloan and the Jazz to take him here.

21. New Orleans Hornets (Pete): Chase Budinger, SG, Arizona

For a good team, the Hornets could really use help everywhere except PG. I’m taking Budinger because he’s the type of player that could benefit from playing with a Chris Paul. He never lived up to expectations at Arizona because he isn’t really suited to be the main guy. However, he has a good outside shot and is a good finisher with his 44-inch (yes, you read that right) vertical leap. He could immediately contribute as a rotation player, which is all he’ll ever be in the league.

22. Dallas Mavericks (Dannie): Terence Williams, SG/SF, Louisville

Jason Kidd is a free agent and I am sure the Mavs would like some security by drafting a point but in our mock all the good ones are gone and Jeff Teague is more Jason Terry like than, a true point guard who can distribute.  The Mavs have a clear hole at shooting guard though and Terence Williams is a ball of talent who can do a lot of different things on the court.  If Kidd returns he is a perfect running mate in transition and he can provide defensive help on the perimeter as well.

23. Sacremento Kings (Pete): Jeff Teague, PG, Wake Forest

Teague has as much talent as any of the PG’s in this draft, but I think his inconsistency and lack of leadership skills really hurt Wake Forest this year, as that team should have been much better than they ended up. The Kings do need a PG though, and if Teague matures, he could be a good one.

24. Portland Trailblazers (Dannie): Austin Daye, SF/PF, Gonzaga

Portland probably still needs a point guard but there aren’t any much better than what they currently have on the roster available.  They also could use some depth at PF and a starting SF.  They get both with Austin Daye at 6’10, ball skills, three-point range and post offense.  Word is he is rising up the draft board with his workouts and proving he isn’t as soft as his reputation suggests.  There is no doubt the kid has a ton of talent and might be the most versatile and skilled player in the draft.  Perfect fit for a Portland team in terms of need, style of play and their philosophy to stockpile young talent.

25. Oklahoma City Thunder (Pete): B.J. Mullens, C, Ohio State

Mullens was the #1 ranked high school player in the country last year by Rivals.com. The 6 players who got that honor before him? Beasley, Oden, Gerald Green, D-Howard, LeBron and Melo. Not bad company. At 7’1”, Mullens can handle the ball, shoot it a bit and has great athleticism for a kid his size. He was expected to come in a have an Oden-like impact at OSU, but didn’t. He’s a project, and needs a little fire, but is a fine risk here at #25 for a team that needs frontcourt help anyway.

26. Chicago Bulls (Dannie): Marcus Thornton, SG, LSU

This pick is a safe pick for the Bulls.  Marcus Thornton is a senior with two seasons of proven production.  If they can’t resign Ben Gordon they get a similar player in Thornton as a slightly undersized scoring guard who can shoot.  If they do keep Gordon they still lack depth behind him and this pick helps fill that hole.  Two bonuses with Thornton are he drives well and has a nice body for a shorter player so he gets to the line at a nice rate, is a terrific defender and doesn’t turn the ball over much (only 1.8 per game this season).   Averaged 27 ppg in this two NCAA tournament games.

27. Memphis Grizzlies (Pete): Danny Green, SF, North Carolina

I would try to trade this pick to anyone at this point. Really nothing I like here for the Grizzlies. Since we aren’t mocking trades, I guess  Memphis could use a shooter here after picking up a big man in Thabeet. Green is a good enough shooter and a decent defender to boot. He is accustomed to a secondary role, so will have no trouble doing so in the NBA.

28. Minnesota Timberwolves (Dannie): Darren Collison, PG, UCLA

No brainer.  We haven’t had the Wolves take a pure point guard because we have been picking the best available palyer.  They clearly have a need since Foye is best served as a combo guard and Telfair isn’t a starter either.  Collison is solid, pass-first and a good shooter and defender.  While he is projected to be only a very good back up point guard he is probably better than Telfair at this point who can’t shoot to save his life.

29. Los Angeles Lakers (Pete): Dante Cunningham, SF, Villanova

I’m not even going to try to hide that this is a homer pick, BUT, it’s not a bad pick. The Lakers will likely need help at SF with Ariza and Odom hitting free agency. Cunningham is athletic, has shown an ability to improve his game, and will hit that 12-foot jumper of his 90% of the time. He’s also an active defender and rebounder. We don’t know whether he can be a true SF in the NBA, but all the remaining players have serious questions. Most mocks have him going in the high 2nd round, so I’m not being that crazy taking him here.

30. Cleveland Cavaliers (Dannie): Sam Young, SG/SF, PIttsburgh

I really like Sam Young and think he could become a very good role player in the league.  He is NBA ready which is what the Cavs need since they are a contender looking to win a lot right now.  They have no back-up wing player behind James, West or Williams that can create his own shot so I like Young in this spot for depth.

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Comments

  1. Stu says:

    Questions:

    1)  Are both of you guys going to make independent picks for the Sixers, regardless of whose turn it is?

    2)  Is there any guy around 9 – 16 who may slip that you would like to see the Sixers trade up and draft (i.e. who would be the best player in terms of a fit for the Sixers that may be snagged a few picks ahead of them and may be worth a future #1)?  Who might be the best trading partner?

    3)  Who are the guys projected to go ahead of the Sixers that you think would be a terrible fit on the current Sixers roster?

  2. deepsixersued says:

    Dannie, unless they trade down, I agree with you on Thabeet to Memphis; I figured as a rotation of him and Gasol at the 5 but Gasol at the 4 is intriguing.

    Rubio works at the 3rd pick Pete because they have J.Green AND D.J.White at the 4. White looked good in a little sample at the end of the year and Westbrook is sort of a combo guard.

    As far as Sacramento, I think they try to get their 3 among 2 players, E.Clark or D.Derozen, who I think may be one of those workout wonders in the next few weeks. J.Thompson!s knack of playing like a 3 may allow Clark and him to work, but to me Clark has a little J.Wright in him and I wouldn!t take him.

    Pete, I like Curry as much as you and that would be ballsy of Wash.; how do they go here? I think whatever p.g. establishes himself in the workouts goes here, and I think J.Holliday, [measured 6!4",210 lbs., and the best defender goes here, after all Wash. doesn!t need anymore scoring, with or without Arenas.

    Minn. probably wishes Alrich was still in the draft about now but since they seem to have given up on the Foye p.g. experiment, they draft the best pure p.g. [Jennings], figuring to go big later.

    I think G.St. takes Evans because a small p.g. doesn!t work next to Ellis and they can split up the ballhandling chores.

    The Knicks get Curry but they won!t get Lebron to go with him.

    Derozen goes #4, I forgot.

    I think Hill!s offensive rawness during these workouts has him slide, a lot of the good things he does won!t show in a workout setting.

  3. Dannie says:

    Suede – Where is Harden then at this point?  And we gotta get you using some type styling.  At the very least paragraph breaks for better readability of your comments.

  4. Pete says:

    stu - 

    1. I’ll pick for the Sixers, but I’m sure Dannie will say if he agrees or not in his next pick. We will do this several times as the draft nears, so we might do it differently later. 
    2. I could see Ty Lawson or Johnny Flynn slipping because of their size a la Jameer. I think you could trade into the 4-7 area because the players that will be drafted there aren’t really 4-7 caliber. Maybe trade a player and a our pick to get Curry? 
    3. Dannie can probably be more specific, but pretty much any SF or PF would be a terrible fit at this point. Especially considering the plethora of PG’s in this class. 
    dss-
    keep in mind, this isn’t our prediction, rather what we would do if we ran the teams. 
    I don’t like DeRozan very much. 
  5. deepsixersued says:

    Dannie, sorry, I am a one finger typer. Harden replaces a guy similar in build, A.Parker to Toronto at 9.

  6. deepsixersued says:

    Pete, I agree about Derozen, he is another one of those UPSIDE guys that may not pan out. Pete and Dannie, is there any package ,short of killing our team, that Colangelo would take for Bosh, and does he work at the 5 next to Elton.

  7. Dannie says:

    All good Suede, I cleaned it up a bit.  I can’t see Harden’s proven production and rumored improved physique dropping that low.  Earl Clark will have to dominate workouts for him to move up that high I think.  But I do like him as a versatile player.

  8. The Greek says:

    Is the mock over?  Or is it ongoing?  I just logged on and got excited to see who you dudes had us taking.

  9. The Greek says:

    ok sorry I just read your answer to my question.   So far I like what is left for us to pick, keep it up fellas!

  10. deepsixersued says:

    Dannie, I!ll be honest, I looked at the team!s needs and Harden, to me, only possibly fits next to Ellis, in an Iggy type role. After #1, this is a real crapshoot as far as team needs. Could be a lot of trading with the economic situation, and all.

  11. guest says:

    Nice job so far you guys!

    One question for Dannie:

    I live in NC so I watch a lot of Carolina Basketball.  I’m not a fan, however I follow them closely.  I do believe Ty Lawson is the real deal.  Just like you.  I love his speed and smart decision making.  But I consider picking him at 8 is a bit of a stretch.  I think this because I think an 82 game schedule is going to be tough for him.  Do you think Lawson will be durable enough for an 82 game season?  If so, he would be a perfect fit for D’antoni and the Knicks.

  12. Dannie says:

    Suede – Because it’s a crapshoot you will simply see more teams just picking best available on their board and by all accounts Harden is the best guard right now and is NBA ready.

  13. Dannie says:

    Guest – I think Lawson will be fine.  I think the perception he is not durable is unfounded.  In three years he’s played 105 games and 27 MPG on average at UNC, at a high level no less.

    I would be more concerned if he had injuries in areas that nag, linger and build up (knees and back particularly).  He sprained his ankle once and had a bad toe that he recovered from about as well as any player could by dominating on the biggest stage.

    Furthermore he will be involved in an NBA strength and conditioning program to prepare him for playing more games.

  14. Pete says:

    Suede –

    nothing we could give for Bosh that I can see.

  15. guest says:

    Understood Dannie.  I think he is a tough player that will be able to play through some of the pain.  He proved that in March.  So hopefully the strength and conditioning program will do him some good.

    I also am not sold on Rubio.  I know he’s young, but he is not strong or athletic enough to compete on the level of expectations on a nightly basis in the NBA.  From what I can tell, he is decent at playing the passing lanes on defense and can make Jason Kidd type passes on offense.  But I see him struggling his Rookie season and learning as he goes.  The International game is so different to the NBA it’s hard to predict how well a player will translate.  Some come in and play solid, others struggle at first.  Should be interesting. 

  16. deepsixersued says:

    Dannie, I just feel Evans will go ahead of him.

    I think Milwaukee keeps Sessions and lets Villanueva go[not a Skiles type] and select D.Blair [-a Skiles type].

    I think  New Jersey takes Henderson [safe pick] but regrets not taking Ellington later.

    Charlotte takes T.Williams, L.B. and defense again. It allows Augustine to play off the ball.

    Dannie and Pete, Missanelli reported yesterday that E.S. went to L.A. to talk to Rambis plus to watch Ellington and Henderson workout. [A. Tellum] Henderson just signed with an agent afterward. Using a conspiracy theory, did he get a positive vibe from E.S., and even though Ellington fits a need more, if both are there when we pick, who are you both taking?

  17. Dannie says:

    I like Terrence Willliams and was about to pick him for Charlotte but then you just have two Gerald Wallace’s and no one who can shoot.  And I think you shouldn’t just ignore the UNC connection.  Although I could easily see Jordan liking Williams a lot.

    No conspiracty theories.  Henderson is a first round pick in this weak draft it was just a matter of time before he signed with an agent.  I take Ellington, I’ve said it before.

  18. Jimmy says:

    Pete what will be your reaction when the 76ers take Luke Harongody in the second round?

  19. Dannie says:

    Jimmy – If only we had a second round pick.  sigh

  20. Pete says:

    Jimmy -

    just seeing “76ers” and “Harangody” that close to each other in a sentance makes me shudder. 

    to be honest, I’ll always route for any ND player – no matter how bad I think they will be. 

    He’s a complete moron if he doesn’t return. So is Scottie Reynolds. 

  21. Jacob says:

    - Wouldn’t this be a nice starting five?

    Rubio/Gordon/Thornton/Camby/Kaman

    – Luke Harangody is only allowed to play for the Jazz or Pacers

  22. jjg says:

    I say forget banking on college draft, most entering U.S. players are unfinished products and many have warped heads.  Sixers need to keep pace with rivals, spend necessary resources to acquire the best available shooting PLAYER in Europe/South America/wherever.  The U.S. universities are not a motherlode of ready talent as in former days.  Go worldwide to find a fundamentally sound player with guts and a shooting eye.  Others organizations do it.

  23. Pete says:

    Jake-

    What you gonna do with Baron Davis? Camby only has 1-2 years left, gotta take Griffin. 
  24. jurnee16 says:

    I totally agree Pete…I think Maynor is the pick if he is there because of his 3-point shooting…if he is gone Calathes should be the pick…I would take either of them over Flynn  because Flynn can’t shoot and both Maynor and Calathes have NBA 3-point range…I would probably take them over Lawson because they are better passers than him…I think Lawson amd Flynn are better athletes than Maynor and Calathes but Maynor and Calathes each have better PG skills and 3 point shooting ablility…they adress two needs for the Sixers (lack of PG and 3-point shooting ability) while Lawson and Flynn only adress on (lack of PG)….

  25. jurnee16 says:

    I don’t think I made total sense right there but all I was trying to say was that I think Maynor and Calathes are more complete players than Lawson and Flynn and I would be happier with one of the former over one of the latter…Calathes isn’t a great defender but he is probably the best passer in the draft and can knock down the three…Maynor might not be as good of a passer as Calathes but he can do everything else as well as Calathes and is a better athlete and defender….

  26. deepsixersued says:

    Calathes is a good fall back pick if somebody doesn!t drop to us. Dannie, do you think Nash!s semi ultimatum [I want to see what kind of roster they assemble] has Pheonix look at other positions rather than his successor at p.g. . Every little bit helps.

  27. Dannie says:

    Suede - I think Phoenix has no choice but to strengthen the roster for now with the idea that Nash is the point for at least 3 more seasons.  Look for his successor after you lock him up and he can be a good teacher.  If you do it now it sends the wrong message to him if you really want him to sign an extension.  They are in a tough spot as they need to get younger and better immediately.

  28. Dannie says:

    Apparently Nick Calathes won’t be an option for anyone.  Word is he has agreed to terms on a deal to play in Greece with Panathinaikos.  Deal would pay him like a late lottery pick when you factor in he gets a house, car and tax relief.

  29. deepsixersued says:

    I hope draftexpress is right Dannie, they have Lawson falling to us at #17. I hope we can get a 2nd pick and get our shooter also, that would be a good summer. C.Reina has some good draft reports on Real G.M. I believe, breaks down the p.g.!s well. Dannie, what does Flynn do better than Lawson? I don!t understand how he goes ahead of him.

  30. Dannie says:

    Suede - Statistically Flynn didn’t do much better than Lawson this past season.  No one did. Ty did everything well.  It’s just a matter of can he translate it to the league.  He didn’t turn the ball over, found teammates in transition and by cutting up half court defenses, he made pull up jumpers, he made threes, got to the foul line and shot 80% while there.

    My biggest questions are:

    • Can he play that way in the NBA?
    • Can he extend his good shooting to three point range?
    • Does he have potential still or is he at his ceiling?
    • Can he defend well enough?

    I think Ty will be good.  Like I told Pete size is less of an issue in today’s NBA where you can’t touch, ride, guide and body up perimeter players (any players).  So his quickness will always be an advantage and in full effect.  He is smart, with good vision and capable of executing sharp passes.  He is strong so he can take contact when it does occur.  He is athletic.  He has the potential to be a very good defender.  He increased his shooting every season which is a good predictor of future growth as well.

    If he is in spot up catch and shoot situations I think he can make NBA threes at a good rate in a short time (most rookies need to adjust).

    The one thing he will have to work on is getting his release quicker because I think guys will play back off him and he will need to pull them in and keep them honest by pulling up and knocking down that shot (inside the arc and beyond three).

    Flynn is a similar player that doesn’t shoot as well as Ty but is more explosive to the rim with his leaping ability.  If Flynn measures out better (taller, longer arms etc) and/or Ty measures poorly ppl will probably take Flynn before Ty which in my opinion would be a mistake.  Ty is a more NBA ready player with more skills shooting the ball and managing a team since he just doesn’t turn it over at all.

    Give me Ty 100% over Flynn if that is a choice.

  31. Dannie says:

    Also I think Ty is a better fit. 

    I think Flynn has to be penetrating to make a big impact because of his still developing shot. 

    Ty while very good penetrating, can also be a very good spot up shooter and that is the biggest need.  On the Sixers I expect touches for Brand in the post (low and high) and pick and roll.  I expect a lot of touches for Thad and Iguodala to drive and post up as well.  That leaves much less opportunity for the point guard to be dribbling around all the time like Miller did.  On the Sixers the point should be able to defend, manage the game with smart decisions, push the ball and force the break, make open catch and shoot jumpers AND then weave in some sharp, timely penetration for scores and dishes.  Key word is sharp, straight line with a purpose.  Not what Miller did which forced a lot of guys to stand around.

    Also the point needs to know the right times for each of those situations. Needs to know when Brand needs a touch, when Thad needs a touch and when Dala needs a touch. Needs to know when he needs to make a play to score or pass. Know when to get Sam and open dunk to keep him happy.

    Honestly the point guard I just described is Chauncey Billups.

  32. jjg says:

    Agree.  Given Sixers roster (and assuming Miller is gone), Ty Lawson, if available, over Jonny Flynn.  Size concerns?  Exhibit A:  Jameer Nelson.  Exhibit B:  T.J. Ford.  Exhibit C:  Kyle Lowry.  Different players, but each has succeeded in spite of size.  Lawson’s a winner, will make NBA adjustments.

  33. Dannie says:

    Exhibit C: Aaron Brooks, Exhibit D: Will Bynum

    Best exhibit of them all is Chris Paul if we are talking 6-foot or below guys.

  34. Dave T says:

    Pete & Dannie, nice post!  Didn’t even see it I was so busy reading the coach/Brand threads.  Comments on some players/picks: 

    -James Harden:  Classic example of a guy that people are WAAAAY overjudging for having a bad tournament.  In fact, I’d say one of the worst predictors of talent is only relying on their tournament production, and ignoring their accomplishments against the regular season competition.  Harden was unquestionably the best player in the Pac-10 all year.  He isn’t flashy, very true…but he shows poise, efficiency, is an excellent shooter from 3 point land and midrange J’s, showed HUGE defensive improvement from fresh to soph year…and is an extremely good rebounder and passer for a SG.  IMO, athleticism has and will always be the most overrated trait in this sport.  Harden can ball, he has a great IQ, and his work ethic and maturity are that of Thad Young.  He, like Eric Gordon of last year, should be top 4 pick talents that will slide a few spots uneccessarily.

    Thabeet:  He will certainly fill a role for a team like Memphis or Minny at C…but I have to say, the dude’s basketball IQ rivals that of Sammuel Dalembert, and that’s saying something.  Can he block?  Hell yes.  Can he alter shots?  Very much so.  But if you want some great unintentional comedy, watch Thabeet on offense WITHOUT the ball.  Dude is one of the worst screeners for a big man I have ever seen, is slow to recognize any type of floor spacing, and has no eye whatsoever for passing out of the post.  And while he’s slowly improved his footwork, as did Roy Hibbert over his career, his offense is still a joke.  The fact he’s going #2-5 shows just how weak this class is for bigs.  He is a poor man’s Mutumbo.

    Demar Derozen:  This kid has done nothing.  Most classic example of all hype with no substance from this year’s draft that is leaving far, far too early.  Just like Paul Harris from ‘Cuse, who would have declared for the NBA out of high school, only to learn, “Wait a minute, I’m an athlete and haven’t actually learned the game yet at a high level…”  this is Derozen.  He’s a great athlete with amazing quickness and slashing ability.  He showed promise as a future scorer someday at USC and improved during the year, but he’s a joke to me to go this early.  Can’t see him being a solid contributer for three years in the NBA…just a gamble of a risky pick.  I feel the same about…

    Tyreke Evans.  So let’s see…he has one of the worst 3 point FG %’s for a starting PG in all of college basketball.  Has absolutely no midrange game either.  So we’ve established he can’t shoot.  Now, if you are Brevin Knight or Eric Snow and are a cerebral PG, that’s great…T Evans is nothing like this.  He is a ball dominating guard that IMO is the classic shoot first, street ball mentality.  Calling him a PG is an insult to the position’s name.  The “leadership” he showed at Memphis that Calipari raves about is because they put the ball in his hands and allowed him to slash to his hearts content.  He’s a mediocre passer.  At best.  Looks for his own shot first.  Goes for the flashy play instead of the efficient one…can’t shoot.  Why would anyone take him based on his possible potential over other polished products?

    Wayne Ellington…on the flipside…is the guy I WOULD bank on with his potential that is not yet fulfilled.  I really thought last year was a make or break year for him and Lawson to really show improvement in their games, and both came to the table having worked hard on their game over the year.  We all know Ellington’s shooting ability…but what impressed me most during the second half of the season is other little things.  His fundamentals seemed better…his on ball defense had improved, he chased after rebounds with more hunger, blocked out his man so opposition guards weren’t able to run in the lane and grab boards, and at times surprised me with a passing game that was inconsistent, but he showed me enough to think he will improve on it.  He’s also improved his handle, and showed a nice ability to even post up on the block against smaller players with a drop step, or turn around with a “face the basket” post game.  He’s got the shot (lost art), work ethic, well coached, and while he’s not there now, I think he will be a very versatile offensive player in the NBA when he develops more.  Many mock drafts have him going in the late 20′s…laughable to me, he should be in the 10-18 range easily.

    Chase Budinger:  One thing you guys didnt mention in your blurb about him is his passing ability.  He’s not just a 3 point gunner…he brings some Luke Walton IQ-isms to the offensive end, which in the NBA, if you are a shooter and not a great defender, is the other most important trait you need to bring to the table.  It’s clear he’s not a go to guy in college or the NBA, but the guy just flat out knows the game.  He has an intuitive sense of where to be and rotate to on the offensive end, can really thread the needle and find seems almost PG like at times from the wing with passing, and is extremely crafty in traffic in his ability to score or dish in the lane.  Shooting is obviously the most coveted trait, but he brings more to the table then I hear a lot of people give him credit for.  Great size too, and has really started to bulk up.  

    Mayner:  Would like him as a pickup for us…IF we bank on him not being our starting PG, but rather as a Delonte West type of combo guard to come off the bench that can give us scoring punch, 3 point shooting, and some assists and energy.  I just don’t see this guy as a starting NBA PG.  That means if we take him, I want him claiming Lou Will’s spot, and Lou gone.  It also still means we need a PG of the future.  I think he CAN play PG at the NBA level…but I don’t think we are shooting high enough tabbing him as the guy we hand A-Miller’s torch to.  If we can’t land Lawson, Flynn or Curry for the PG spot, more worth it to draft a backup SG/SF.  

    Jordan Hill:  If he were being picked in the 10-15 range, he would be this year’s classic “real underrated player”.  Unfortunately, this class lacks with so many big men, he’s in the top 5, which is just weird.  One thing I wanted to add though…so many people talk about his defensive ability and toughness…both true…the one thing I dont hear much is about his offense.  He’s really impressed me since his frosh year with how much he’s worked on his game…he’s improved it very Dante Cunningham-like.  His offensive game blows a guy like Thabeet’s out of the water…Jordan Hill has excellent footwork, a true back to the basket game, can finish with either hand around the rim, and has a variety of reliable post moves.  With that work ethic, it’ll only get better in time…I really like him as a non-all star talent, but very solid 6’10 PF in the NBA.  Eventually good for 15 and 9 or so.  

    Earl Clark:  Biggest mystery of the draft, IMO.  As the poster said, if he meets his potential this is an all star waiting to happen.  His consistency, intensity and desire have always been problems though…I don’t even think Pitino has any idea if Clark will be looked back on as one of the top players from this draft or a total bust that fades away to Europe.  

  35. Brent says:

    Yes, my favorite time of year when I can come on here and talk with my good old buddies at reclinergm.

    Unlike last year I’m not going to argue the PG big man debate, as it looks almost obvious the Clippers will take Griffen even though Mike Dunleyvy hates B Diddy.  I personally would grab Rubio as I think he is more of a sure thing than Griffen, but thats beside the point.

    What i am here to do is critique your mock, whick i did so greatly last year ;) .  I’ll start off my argument with the #2 pick.  I personally think they take Ricky Rubio here.  I know they have players like Mayo and Gay who need the ball in their hands, but Gay looks to be on his way out, so they could use an other creator.

    The other reason I don’t agree is because they have Marc Gasol, who they really like at C.  If they don’t take Rubio they could go PF, but this is too high for Hill and any others they could look at.

    I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again, the Thunder like Westbrook at PG, and truthfully that is where he needs to be.  If Rubio is still available here (which I don’t think he will be) they trade the pick to someone like Phoenix, who would consider a package of Amare and the #14 for Greene, Collison, and the number 3. 

    If Rubio has been selected they will go with either Harden or Rubio.  The only way they go Hill is if they are eyeing someone like Marcus Thorton, Terrence Williams, or Wayne Ellington (yes he could fall that far) later in the draft.

    I think Curry is way too high, and if Harden is there the Wizards will take him in a seconed.  They have plenty of shooter, and all Curry will be is a shooter.  Harden is more of a complete player, and he fits what they are trying to do.

    Other than that I can’t really argue anything else.  This is a pretty solid mock draft, and IMO better than the first one I saw you put out last year.

  36. Brent says:

    “If Rubio has been selected they will go with either Harden or Rubio.”

    I ment Thabeet.

Trackbacks

  1. [...] ReclinerGM 9. Toronto Raptors (Pete): Tyreke Evans, PG/SG, Memphis [...]

  2. [...] on. Lots of changes since we’ve had the measurements and the workouts to look over since our last mock. To reiterate: This is not a prediction of how the draft WILL go, rather how the draft WOULD go if [...]

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