FINALLY, I very good win for the Sixers. This game looked and felt exacly like the Lakers loss on Wednesday. The Sixers were playing pretty well but never really got closer than 8 or 9 points until seven minutes left in the fourth quarter. The difference, the Sixers were able to make a run and convert it into a lead that held up. On Wednesday every time the Sixers were making a run Kobe would shut it down. Not tonight.
Sixers vs. Detroit Game Notes
Gotta start with Donyell Marshall. He hadn’t played or been active in the last 10 games. With Brand out due to injury this was the perfect opportunity for Marshall to get some burn. I was actually worried Cheeks wouldn’t put him in, thankfully for the Sixers he proved me wrong. If not for Marshall’s big 4th quarter buckets (8 points) the Sixers don’t win this game. And calmly and coolly knocked down a wide open three from the corner, then pump faked Sheed and stepped into a nice elbow jumper. But the big one was the contested three he nailed over Richard Hamilton to give the Sixers a 91-89 lead – and they never looked back.
But what I want to focus on is the only reason I could come up with for him not playing at all this season – defense. He defended Sheed in the post effectively while on the floor for his 14 minutes. And he didn’t give up a lay up to Prince late in the game when he could have easily conceded that basket. I’ve been holding off until the 20-game mark to rant about why he hasn’t played and tonight is exactly the reasons I would have provided for him being active and on the floor. Donyell Marshall is a professional shooter. Just look at his demeanor during that game. While all the young players are jumping around going crazy because this losing team is actually about a win a game, Marshall quitely just goes about his business of making perimeter jump shots. When Andre Iguodala came up LAME again in the 4th quarter Marshall picked him up. Cheeks doesn’t really seem to have any foresight as a coach which is why he doesn’t make adjustments. It takes games like this for him to make a necessary change. Hopefully he makes it.
How effective was the pick and roll with Marshall as the screener and Lou William as the ball handler?
This was actually a well played game. Each team only had 10 turnovers and both teams shot 46% or better (Sixers: 45.9 / Pistons: 48%). The rebounding was close at 40-38 Sixers edge. The difference in the game for me was a traditional strength for Detroit that has escaped them and a traditional weakness of the Sixers that has killed them…
Detroit’s 4th quarter defense was non-existent. The Sixers scored 38 points on 11-20 from the field, giving the us a 14-point margin in the final period. Detroit could not get stops at all with Lou Williams penetrating and Marshall providing a legit perimeter threat. Offensively Detroit scored 24 fourth quarter points which was their 2nd highest point total in the game. They simply couldn’t stop the Sixers because the unit Mo had on the floor consisted of 5 guys that could make a shot. No weak links.
The other key was the Sixers free throw shooting. Prior to this game the Sixers were 28th in the NBA in free throw shooting. Tonight they were 25-29 (86%) and made attempted and made 8 more free throws than Detroit. In that 4th quarter the Sixers were 14-17 from the line. That is winning basketball.
Random Thoughts
- Andre Iguodala had another good 3 quarters of basketball and seems to have found his offensive game a bit. But it can’t go without saying Dala simply is allergic to “clutch.” He offensive decision-making goes out the window late in games. That air ball fadeaway jumper with Prince in his grill almost made me blow a gasket. Thank God for Donyell Marshall.
- Lou Williams figured out what makes him a good offensive player. Use your quickness to get in the damn lane and use your athletic ability to finsh within 10 feet or get fouled. He did exactly that tonight. He didn’t think, he just attacked and I think that is a big reason he didn’t turn the ball over as much.
- Marreese Speights looked like a rookie again tonight in his first start. He looked nervous as he turned the ball over and brick on his first few possessions. But this was just a learning experience for him. Hopefully tomorrow night he will be jitter-free because we will need him to play well against New Jersey’s big front court.
- Andre Miller – 19 points on 8 shots attempts. Nuff said!
- After A.I. started to get hot in the 3rd quarter Willie Green did a good job in the first half of the 4th quarter denying him the ball, making him work to catch the ball and not giving him any room to take over the game. That contribution is duly noted.
This Sixers are at the 9-11 at the twenty game mark. They are 1-win and two games back of the Nets for 2nd in the division. They are a half game out of the 8th playoff spot behind Toronto and 3 games back of Detroit in the 5th playoff spot. How do you feel about the team at this point?
Next game: Tomorrow at New Jersey
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{ 38 comments… read them below or add one }
cheeks must have said something to Iguodala because his shot selection has vastly improved. Dannie, except fot the fadeaway you mention (and i think the shot clock may have been inside of 5). he really hasnt taken any bad jumpers the last 2 games. he has noticeably pulled back on shots that he was taking last week. i thought he played another great game.
Lou Williams was huge tonight. made some crucial baskets in the 4th. somone mentioned that his surge in the 4th qtr of the Laker game was meaningless becasuse the game was over. certainly not the case tonight. great job getting to the basket and getting to the line (8-9 FTs) . not a bad pick of Iversons pass at the end. Lou looks a lot more confident with the ball in his hands.
Andre Miller was our best player for the 3rd straight game. this guy is playing mistake-free ball and scoring at will. 9-10 from the line doesnt hurt.
To answer your question, I feel great about this team right now. Some people may say this was a bad loss for the Pistons, instead of a good win for the Sixers, but I disagree. If you look at Allen Iverson and Rip Hamilton, they both played well and they had a good chance to win this game. I think both teams played well which is why Im feeling so well. We proved to ourselves that when we play good and within ourselves (not turning the ball over, shooting 20 threes etc.) we can beat good teams.
The Raptors are getting thrashed by the Jazz so it looks good right now. Big game tommorow night of course, but I like our chances.
And how about our 2 turnovers in the second half. Thats what turned the ball game around and allowed us to get more shots. I have a question for you Dannie about Andre Iguodala. You say he has been coming up LAME in the fourth quarters, which I can agree to. However, I think he has been playing great for the last week and a half. His field goal % and free throw % are going up while his attempts go up as well. Thats a strong sign I think.
So my question is, If he continues the way hes has been playing for the last week and a half, do you see the Sixers becoming a 50 win team. Obviously a lot has to change, but I see that change starting with Iggy playing better. He’s lead our team to strong second half seasons for the past two seasons, I think he can do the same this season. He just has to keep playing within himself
ivey, marshall playing significant minutes? Speights starting? Rush? hmm i think Ed Stefanski quietly told Mo to start playing the freakin bench he payed sumthin million dollars for instead of letting them atrophy away as onlookers as the sixers get spanked over and over.
saw some of the game; defense was pretty crisp, none of that scrambling and flailing arms.
Hold your breath people; they are starting to play better.
i still think Mo is gone after this season. No hard feelings.
I DVR’d the game last night and it just ended with Lou Will stepping to the line shooting 2, down 1 with 55 seconds to play. Didn’t think to tape the post game show. Well a couple thoughts.
- First I must appologize to DMarshall. Not been a big fan BUT he won the game. His presence after hitting that 3 opened up the offence for Lou Will & company to penetrate and create opportunities. Also did a good job boxing out and decent job on Sheed.
- LOVE REGGIE! after that hard foul on him in the lane(Technical), he sent a message right back by commiting a hard foul on a guard at the top of the key. He is THE MAN!
- Thad Young! Wow! What a move on Sheed in the post!
- Lou Will is BACK!
- Andre, what a ball fake! He understands the game better than 90% of the NBA players. He’d be great on the playground!
- Iggy, good game but his incessant bitching is getting under my skin. It cost him on that TPrince opportunity in transition when I don’t think he hustled back contrary to the announcers.
Finally, This was an effort similar to last year. I hope the coaching staff can build on this in their rotations and use matchups to their advantage, not just stick to a set rotation.
One last thing. After watching last night’s performance, It appears that having both Sammy and EBrand on the court together on offense is a problem. I think Sammy’s role is going to continue to diminish and I really believe he is being shopped around. Possible destination: Ok city????? Maybe for Joe Smith, etc. Can be discussed another day if interested. Gotta enjoy this win!
First of all, defensively Thad on Prince and Iggy on Rip was a major factor compared to last year. K.Rush, be prepared to be deactivated, Theo and now Donyell deserve minutes. Donyell should be used at the end of quarters at least , similar to how Korver was brought in sometimes. Theo is playing smart basketball and as a team we seem to function better when he is on the floor, but we have to watch his minutes. L.Will., I don!t know why the light went on but your duel with Stuckey was priceless. S.F.W., Just Reggie being Reggie. Dannie, last 3 games we picked up in intensity, was it all the “get rid of Mo talk” or E.S. traveling with the team, they are loyal to Mo but I want to taper my enthusiasm because Detroit, to me, is a good matchup for us, and when we start doing this to an Orlando than I will feel; even better.
Great win. In the first half, it didn’t appear to me that we were playing as badly as the score indicated. Committing too turnovers and allowing too many offensive rebounds were what really hurt us, IMO. This will probably sound odd, especially since we fell behind by 15 in the second half, but I felt like things were turning around and we were heading in the right direction halfway through the second quarter. I believe we were down 42-29. Miller drove to the rim on two consecutive possessions, got fouled twice, and hit both free throws each time. Then Iguodala drove to the rim, made the basket, got fouled, and made the free throw. 7 points in 3 straight possessions. I believe this happened after Mo called a timeout. Anyway, from that point forward I really thought our aggression and intensity picked up (on both ends of the floor).
In the second half we took much better care of the ball, limited their offensive rebounds, starting getting a bunch of our own, and stayed in attack mode. I can’t remember Lou taking one single jumper, did he? I also can’t remember very many forced shots from anyone. Sammy stayed under control. There were a couple times it looked like he was going to try to make a move and force one up, but he passed it back out instead. Great to see them all take what was open when it was open. Now let’s see if they can continue this against the Nets. Maybe we are starting to establish something.
jjg…Devil’s advocate???? If the Sixers beat the Nets, we may have to talk.
Donyell Marshall: One of the reasons I’ve always loved him is because he brings one of the most interesting packages to the table for a 6′9 PF. Earlier in his career, before he expanded his game by learning to shoot the 3, he was much more of a bruiser that didn’t take !@#$ from people inside. Once he learned that 3 point shot, he then became really dangerous in that he’s this weird combination of a guy that can hit four 3’s in one game, and also grab 10 boards.
He’s not quick and athletic off the drive, but he has a great IQ and understands angles and when defenders are off balance to make up for it. He’s not a steller defender but he’s usually solid, and makes up for it with hard work. He’s a guy that, because he’s always had starting NBA talent but coaches were never quite sure how to use him, got used to being jerked in and out of lineups, starting unit to bench mob, regular rotation to DNP’s…hence has an amazingly professional attitude, and not only values his playing time, but knows how to take full advantage of it.
I agree with what others have said…it would be great if Donyell could start getting a small slice of regular minutes once Brand comes back. He’s a total pro and has a great skill set, and as he obvioulsy proved last night, he’s still got game and should not only be rotting on the bench.
SFW: I don’t agree with a move to trade Dalembert at all, but I do think Stefanski exploring trade options is always a good idea, just to see what’s out there. If we ever did trade Dalembert (makes roughly $11 per year, probably up around $12 or $12.5 during this backend of his contract I think), we’d need to get back some kind of veteran big to replace him, as well as the SG that can actually shoot that we all crave.
The following are teams that might, at the very least, entertain some talks for D-Bear. Each of these are either desperate for frontcourt help, are playing mostly younger guys and could use a true veteran center, or are rotating 2-3 solid but not great vets at the PF/C position that could use an upgrade: Miami, Charlotte, Memphis, Chicago, San Antonio, Washington, Minnesota, Grizzlies, Indiana, OKC.
As I typed the above, I was thinking to myself: “We need to trade for an older, more veteran big…wait a minute…Dalembert IS technically a veteran big…wait…he’s been in the league SEVEN years…BWAAAAAAHHH!!!!” Seriously, even though we all know he’s been in the NBA a while, don’t most people, when you first hear “Dalembert” still think of him as a young, raw, up and coming talent, maybe in his 3rd or 4th year in the league? Ugh.
This wouldn’t ever happen, but a veteran big I would LOVE as a compliment next to Brand, that has always been one of the most undervalued guys in the L, is Jeff Foster from Indy.
Dave, It seems to me that this team is better suited with a perimeter center in our rotation with Theo, Speights, Marshall & next year JSmith. Sammy is welcome as a part of that but with he & Brand the lane area is a bit clogged. Both Elton & Sammy seem to be comfortable in the same area(around the lane not exactly in the Post). We saw last night additional dimensions available with an outside shooting big man in the game. I welcome Sammy in the rotation but his salary is that of a 4th qtr center and I think we will be seeing Sammy on the bench most during the 4th qtr going forward.
Thank you Mo! Now you need to get both Rush and Marshall in more critical minutes and games. Now we’re cooking!
Brand should mentally feel better that the team won. Hopefully, he can make it back in time for the Nets game and/or the Cavs home and home against the new Central Division Champs (perhaps).
This is what Ed envisioned in this bench!! Mo has to continue using the many weapons this team has. The versatility and capabilities of this roster is incredible!
Hopefully, our shooters will get key minutes EVEN with Brand in the lineup!
The difference in the last three games has been Miller. I think that ankle breaking by Rose stirred him up. If he and Lou continue to play this way we’ll improve. Look! in the lane, on the perimeter, with the winning three pointer; its a Donyell Marshall sighting!!! Mo should have been playing this guy are you serious!
I agree Mo may be gone after this year.
If we’re talking trades, we have to consider the prospect of moving Andre Miller. He is our best player right now, but also our most valuable trading chip. It would hurt the team in the short term, but would be beneficial in the long term by accelerating the development of a very young sixers team and forcing management to find a true PG replacement.
If the Clippers continue to struggle, a Miller, W. Green, and draft pick package for Baron Davis would be a beautiful thing. He would be a perfect fit.
Morty - usually succinct, often pithy – called it: Donyell Marshall, rusty pride of Reading High School, correctly calibrated and lofted a beaut in the most opportune of times. Clutch shedding of the losing cargo. Winning is a habit, dagnabbit! Will they cut down the Nets tonight?
HAHA we are talking trades after a positive Sixers win, seems counterintuitive a little. I think something needs to happen but I am not exactly sure saying what yet because it’s too early. We have seen a lot of bad basketball and only a very very small sample of good basketball.
Where Brand is missed is in the rebounding department and with Sammy in foul trouble, but Brand and Evans LOVE bringing their hardhats against Detroit. But kudos to the Sixers bench for being professional and ready!! Now we need to get Kareem Rush going with his shot!!
Brand was also invited to the “Block Party”, but couldn’t come due to an injury. But this is the team Ed Stefanski has envisioned the last 3 games!
Isn’t it interesting that after Ed Stefanski talks to Mo or makes a big appearance, the team does MUCH better? I’m sure he really talked to Mo about PLAYING HIS BENCH from players 1-12!!
Maybe playing Detroit as a #4 or #5 seed might not be a bad idea (so far), and considering the depth of the Sixers team and the Pistons depth. But it was a tale of two halves for both benches!!
Speights showed his ROOKIE side, but eventually he will get better and perhaps he could be a starting 4 or 5, and have Brand as a starting 4 or 5.
Also, shoutout to the Nets organization, one of the most professional ones in the NBA with Rod Thorn. A true class organization! Thank you for letting Ed Stefanski go to Philadelphia. He is a true fan of the game and was well bred by the guidance of Rod Thorn.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3698010
Interestingly enough, even though it was a preseason game, we creamed the Nets with a big rain of threes (14 of them). The Nets perimeter defense is still not good. Lately, Harris and Carter have been mortal the last two games, but are still the main focus.
TAKE THE NETS DOWN SIXERS!! GO SIXERS! KEEP THE ENERGY UP!!!
raro, I don’t like BD with us. He makes way too many turnovers and bad decisions as opposed to Miller. We can’t afford to make any more turnovers then we already have. If we trade Miller, Sammy will be included in that trade, but it would be for a veteran big (like everyone else said) and a young PG that can give us about what Miller has been giving us. Right now, I don’t think we can trade Miller while getting back what he is giving our team right now. The only move I would make is Sammy at this point of the season.
I take back the turnovers with Baron. He is avg. 2.50 while Miller is avg. 1.95. Not that big of a difference, but I still like Andre’s clutch ability down the stretch in big games. You see it time and time again with him making big plays. For example, the big pump fake last night. Not to mention he avg. better FG%, FT%, and 3pt% when Baron avg. only 2 more points than him. I would like to keep Miller and Green over BD.
In these last three games, everybody seems to be playing better. Now Sammy needs to be consistent, that is the ultimate WILD CARD!!
Also, why are the Nets so poor at home, yet great on the road?
Vince Carter, playing with passion or just advertising himself to seemingly playoff bound teams (Cavs? Lakers? Heat?)
How much are the Nets really involved in terms of trying to nabb LeBron James? I’m sure LeBron would enjoy playing with Harris and some better pieces the Nets will hopefully get. Really, I hope he STAYS IN CLEVELAND for the Sixers sake!! Najera, Hayes, and Dooling, good role players signed with the Nets for a reason, as opposed to signing with contenders. The LeBron sweepstakes has something to do with it!! To be continued in 2010 and Barkley is RIGHT about LeBron’s free agency comments.
Suede had brought up Brad Miller for Sammy deal earlier. That has potental. I think contractually Miller has 1 less year then Sammy. Not in love with his age though but he is the style of center who could fit in offensively.
I wouldd do miller for sammy in a heart beat. i would even throw in a number 1 to seal the deal.
“Best pump fake in the game” (Salmi, the wizard) - I don’t understand how Miller suckers so many defenders with it. Yeah, he shows a lot of the valuable orange ball but if ya can’t anticipate that, ya haven’t been payin’ attention. His defenders should pledge to themselves to NEVER leave their feet, just stay in front of him. What’s he gonna do, rise and shoot over ‘em?
Regarding Miller’s often-effective change of pace dribble, I used to guard a guy (a lumbering Green Bay Packer fan who wore high black Chuck Taylors and cut-off bicep-baring sweatshirts way before the trend) who often tried the same move on me, but I’d steer him to the puddled pothole or wedge him against the hedge. NBA advance scouts, take note; it can be defended with some ingenuity.
The announcers I was listening to were talking about, the reason it is so effective, is that he never leaves his feet when he shoots, so a pump fake looks exactly like his real shot. But like you said, it can be defended. It usually works on bigs because they usuall are the ones jumping their highest to defend a shot, everytime. Like you see Greg Oden jump to block a shot, everytime there is a shot put up in the key.
Haven’t seen Oden play for Blazers yet. Read an NBA scribe recently who said that their improved play is more attributable to Brandon Roy’s leadership-by-example than Oden’s gifts, which don’t include much offense.
yes, Oden hasn’t done much offensively, but if you watch him defensively, it’s clear he is a shot blocker and rebounder, while his offense game will get better with time. I was just saying in general big men are more likely to fall for Miller’s pump fake, espeacially down on the block or in the key.
guest Understood your point, just happened to move to a Blazers comment from there. I don’t think biting on fake is an ‘opponent size’ issue but rather a ’careless’ vs. ’measured’ response issue. The best defenders of any height proportion stay down until a shooter actually commits; admittedly easier said than done. Enjoyed reading your feedback.
jjg: thanks for the notice, but I believe Rob has been on the “play Marshall” train all season. To me, it’s another strike against Mo that it takes so long for him to try Marshal out – if used properly, he could be our poor man’s Robert Horry. Either Marshall or Rush needs to be used consistently, in my opinion.
I didn’t see the game, but looking at the box is encouraging. Igoudala had another solid shooting night, and Lou is appearing to relearn what he does most effectively.
Key matchup for tonight:
Devin Harris v.s Andre Miller
“Harris averaged 18.0 points and 5.0 assists in those games, but was outplayed by Philadelphia point guard Andre Miller, who had 22.5 points and 8.0 assists per contest.” ESPN 12/6/08 Nets-Sixers preview
http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/preview?gameId=281206020
The previous two meetings with the Nets last season:
3/22/08 @ PHI: (Sci-Fi Night) Nets 87 Sixers 91
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=280322020
4/1/08 @ NJ Sixers 108 Nets 99
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=280401017
Close games, but I wonder if Elton Brand will play tonight. Our frontcourt has been able to take advantage over the weaker frontcourts and the Nets big men are still young and raw.
jjg, I see your point. Someone earlier brought up the game last year where Miller pumped and got AI so high up in the air that he landed on Andre’s back. So your right, it is more of a lack of careness rather than size.
I would love to see Rush and/or Marshall to play more consistently, but I don’t want him taking minutes from any of our starters, other than Sammy. Our bench needs to improve, but the last two games have been good games, because all of our starters have played well. I think Rush and Marshall are going to be most effective at the end of quarters. The time where a starter doesn’t want to pick up a quick foul, or we are looking to have the last shot, thats where these two players should get the ball in my opionion.
Guest– that is a great strategy for Rush and Marshall. But also, Marshall can create matchup problems since most bigs want to settle in the paint and not contest the threes.
Elton Brand’s career numbers v.s Nets (through 13 games; 2000-07)
18.1 pts 10.2 rebs
Rob, I agree Marshall does create matchup problems. Much like Rasheed Wallace does. Reggie Evans last year had a tough time in the playoffs gaurding him. When Elton and Speights are in the lineup. I don’t want Marshall taking up either of those two’s minutes for long stretches of the game. So unless we want Marshall playing at the 3 spot, the best situation is at the end of the game. Maybe the last 3-4 minutes of each quarter?
Guest - I disagree. Last night was won because of the bench. They scored 42 of the 96 points and down the stretch is was Lou Williams and Donyell Marshall shouldering the offensive burden while Iguodala again came up lame. Willie Green’s defense on A.I. to start the 4th quarter shouldn’t go unnoticed he did a great job after A.I. got hot in the 3rd.
And the reason the bench has been better overall is because Mo Cheeks is actually using them.
Guest - I actually think you are being to rigid regarding Marshall/bench minutes. Play should be determined by performance on the court not the letters on the back of the jersey or starting status.
The way Lou and Marshall worked the pick and pop wouldn’t it make sense for a bench/rotational line up to look something like this…
Part of the problem Mo has started to address was having too many bench guys in at the same time resulting in a bunch of “cold” players trying to maintain a lead – not smart. I’d like to see Marshall in at power forward much more when Brand goes out.
Morty – I don’t even think Marshall would be a “poor man’s” Robert Horry. I think he would be exactly that for the Sixers given minutes and game conditioning. I personally see very little difference between Horry and Marshall in the later stages of their career besides opportunity.
Guest– only in certain stages of the game, like yesterday, Marshall would be great to have in those games. Against Dwight Howard for some time (extent), Marshall would be a great mismatch.
Also, guys, check out a “Big Baby” crying during yesterday’s Celtics victory over the Blazers! LOL
http://scores.espn.go.com/nba/recap?gameId=281205002
Dannie, I agree and I too would like to see Marshall come in for Brand, but either way wouldn’t Marshall get about 17-20 minutes a night, coming off the bench at the end of quarters? I think those are crucial and significant minutes. Maybe your right. Maybe I am getting sucked into the numbers that the starters are putting up. But I still think that the starters have done much better the last two games, however, I agree I didn’t give the bench enough credit. Lou, Willie, and Marshall did potentially win that game for us.
Also, before when I said, “So unless we want Marshall playing at the 3 spot, the best situation is at the end of the game.”
I meant that to say, so unless we want Marshall playing at the 3 spot, the best situation is at the end of all the quarters. Meaning along with Dannie, I would like to see Marshall’s minutes go up significantly.
I saw that Big Baby thing also on SC, haha that was hilarious. He just had a huge meltdown, lol.
Dannie: Just being conservative with the “poor man’s” adjective. Like I said, the Sixers need either Rush or Marshall to be a semi-consistent 3 point threat in order to diversify their offense.