Now fully entrenched on the new and improved Recliner GM I plan on adding a new segment called “76ers Rumors.” I will regularly scour the web for any and every bit of 76er-related rumors and post them all on the blog. Now you can get all your Sixers hearsay in one place, let me do the work. ; )
The first installment involves the beloved Billy King. We all love BK, right? Well another Eastern Conference team seems to have interest in the former 76er GM. The Milwaukee Bucks have contacted some big wigs in the Philadelphia 76ers’ organization regarding King. Not sure whether he was or is planning to be interviewed, but they are definitely doing some preliminary background checks.
Billy King’s name has been floated around the New York Knicks as well, with Donnie Walsh taking over. King is good friends with Walsh, and the way the NBA works it wouldn’t be surprising if BK ended up with a front office position with the Knicks.
Consider this
We have lived through the horrid Billy King years. From his overpaying Kenny Thomas to the unthinkable signing of Chris Webber. Put yourself in the shoes of a Sixers’ executive who had a part in firing of Billy King. We assume he was let go because of unmet performance expectations as well as the opportunity to snatch up a perceived better option going forward in Ed Stefanski.
What do you say to the Bucks when they call you? Do you support the notion that Billy King is a viable option at GM for another club?
Philly fans, please be “less” biased then me and set aside the idea that vouching for King would almost certainly sabotage the future of a Conference opponent!
If you want more sports coverage especially Sixers and Phillies, sign up for free email alerts or grab to the Recliner GM RSS feed. Thanks for reading.Source: The Journal Times
7 comments ↓
Billy can sort of ID talent in 10 drafts he got 2 good players (Iggy and Young) and 2 ok players (Dalembert and Carney) and he just can’t be trusted with the checkbook.
And the jury is still out on 2007. At the time I recall EVERYBODY wanted the 5 year older, and 20 pound heavier (stronger) 6 ‘ 8″ Al Thorton of Florida State
Shooting %
Thorton 42.6% FG 34.4% 3pt 75% FT
Young 53.6% FG 28.6% 3pt 76% FT
Numbers
Thorton 12.4pts, 4.4 Rpg, 1.2 assists, 27 minutes
Young 7.8pts, 4.2 Rpg, 0.7 assists, 20 minutes
Without a doubt Thorton is more polished, but he’s also 24 and Young is 19. Give Young 5 more years and he should be a better player, but that might come to late. Iggy, Miller, and Dalembert are in their primes now.
2007 Thad Young
2006 Draft Rodney Carney (in trade for pick)
2005 draft pick traded away
2004 Iggy !!
2003 draft pick traded away
2002 given to Golden state we get John Salmons from Spurs and averaged 4pts per game
2001 Dalembert
2000 Speedy Claxton
1999 pick traded to Utah Jazz
1998 Larry Hughes
Hiring? 1 for 4
2003 Randy Ayers (bad)
2003 Chris Ford (worse)
2004 Jim Obrien (bad)
2005 Mo Cheeks (good)
Trades ?
2004 Chris Webber (bad)
2006 AI for A. Miller (good)
Billy King is interesting because if you look at some of his moves in the late 90’s/early 00’s, compared to the mid - late 00’s King moves…it’s like two different GMs. Obviously, Larry Brown had something to do with that, but King was still the official GM then, and he had a say and hand in the late 90’s trades.
For instance…a lot of people forget how creative he used to be in making trades. This is a guy that pulled off a trade to land Joe Smith in the middle of the AI era, thinking an 18 & 9 potential all star would cement our lineup for years. It didn’t…but that took guts. I also loved his creativity in the three team Larry Hughes for Tony Kukoc-in-his-prime trade…a move NO ONE saw coming, and even though he was a horrible fit for LB’s system, it showed off King’s knack for seeing openings for a trade when there seemingly were none.
He also acquired a nice solid, defensive talent in Eric Snow, which paid huge dividends…and getting KVH and DC in the same year (the underated ‘03 team that was VERY good) were also nice moves.
I also think the CWebb trade shouldn’t be nearly as blasted as it is…very easy to make fun of it in retrospect, given the fact he wound up having half a leg, no work ethic, and was a total puss…but I’d say Philly was pretty 75/25 in going gung-ho crazy in favor of the deal WHEN it happened. Let’s not forget all the “C-Webb comes to Philly!” covers and headlines…and the fact that he had been getting 20 pts, 10 rbs and 5 asts in 50 games for the Kings that year until the trade deadline.
Then in the mid 00’s he stopped being creative, and his biggest crimes were overpaying guys from Korver, to Willie Green, to Kenny Thomas, etc…which I see as pretty bad, but not horrendous. And it’s looking like Dalembert is pretty much being paid his worth…which means his only other crime (which is a bad one) is standing pat, and not having the guts to make even a minor shake up while AI’s best years were wasted.
Three biggest Billy King crimes in retrospect:
–Signing Dikembe Mutumbo to a FOUR YEAR SIXTY MILLION A YEAR DEAL when Mutumbo was already 85032 years old.
–Standing pat while AI was putting up 30 pts and almost 8 asts a game on a crappy team.
–Drafting Larry Hughes over Paul Pierce…easily the biggest Sixer crime of the last two decades. AI + Pierce + the defensive core of Snow, Mckie, Ratliff, Lynch, etc…would have easily given us one ring, if not more.
Dave - I think Billy King is pretty good at some things (drafting), bad at others (negotiating contracts) and overall not consistently good enough to be a reliable NBA GM.
The coaching carousel he had before Mo bothered me a lot because he used them as scapegoats for the teams poor performance. Players win games and King never game those coaches enough talent to be even moderately successful. I would rather have a consistent figure at coach that a new guy every year in down times like that.
I agree Philly was blinded by “Chris Webber” the name and didn’t see how terrible of a deal this was at the time for the Sixers. But I hated the deal from day 1. Here is what wasn’t hindsight:
From a pure cost vs. value standpoint I didn’t think it made sense unless you expected to compete for an NBA finals immediately. You had Korver (2nd year), Sammy (3rd year) and Iggy (rookie) in the starting line-up along with AI and Webber in the starting line-up with absolutely NO bench in 04-05. And then trotted that same line-up out the following year with Salmons eventually moving into the starting line-up in place of Korver. Only real addition was Steven Hunter. I don’t know anyone that would consider those teams a contender.
Taking on Webber’s contract when he had already shown clear signs of a decline (he peaked in 00-01 in terms of production + games played) and physical deterioration (he only played 23 games the season before the trade). That makes this a big gamble in my opinion regardless of how he played in the first 46 games that year. Sacramento traded him at the only possible time they could - when he was still moderately healthy and moderately productive. King took the bait.
Sure he scored 20 and got 9 boards but it was rather inefficient especially for a power forward considering he was taking 18-19 shots and shooting less than 45%.
All that is information and data points readily available before the trade was made not retrospect.
And there is no denying drafting Larry Hughes was just ridiculous - although he looked great at St. Louis. But passing on Dirk and Pierce is inexcusable.
Fully agree about your C-Webb comments Danny, nice post. Even though we didn’t give up much…Corliss, Kenny Thomas, and I’m forgetting another one…the Kings had been PRAYING someone would take C-Webb’s injury prone body, and absurdly huge contract, off their hands for two years…and like you said, King took the bait.
I think my point was just that at least there was some rhyme and reason to it…the Sixers were mired as a 36-39 win team under coaches getting fired and an increasingly frustrated AI…it was kind of King’s poor mans version of the reasons Phoenix just made the ballsy Marion for Shaq trade. I’m not saying I liked or backed the trade then (I remember my first thought was, “Great, we get an over the hill all star that’ll play 60 games tops,”) …but I do see where King was coming from.
Also, I’m curious with one other minor point from your post…do people really think the Jim O’Brien hire was a bust? Obviously not an amazing hire, but I did feel he did a pretty good job with the team that year. He got us playing some D, had a nice relationship with AI, and his 3 point barrage tactic fit nicely when we had Korver. And I thought his “let AI get the ball/play PG more” idea was creative.
I could be wrong, but I had thought the reason he got axed is because:
-Dalembert HATED him and said “fire the coach or I’m not signing.” (Obie was TERRIBLE with D-Bert and killed his confidence with constant juggling of minutes)
-Webber couldnt stand him either…and in Obie’s defense, he wanted Webber to be a post presence on the block…and (literally) Webber said, “No, I’m not doing that, sorry.”
-Obie was very bullheaded and stubborn, and didn’t have great relations with the Sixers front office people.
I could be unaware of some stuff though, are there other Obie-isms I’m not privy to that went down that year?
My first comment on the new site: first of all congratulations, it looks great, I am envious
Second, I have always been a great BK critic so every post and thought that reminds everyone of his bonehead moves is welcome…
no need to repeat them for the 123th time, you guys said them all here above. I would say that King was very good at drafting, average at trades, from bad to horrid as for free agent signings and extentions: overall mediocre, and the Sixers record in his (tto long) tenure explains it pretty well
it’s true Stefasnki inherited a team entirely built by BK, but the Korver trade (and I was a big Korver fan)combined with the talk in which the GM “suggested” Mo to play the young guys more was a key for the team’s explosion in the second part of the season
Stefanski got even lucky, probably (unlike King), I think nobody could have predicted that Thad Young was SO good or that Carney could turn into a serviceable player, but here is when we have to give credit to Mo, who did a heck of a job this year.
as for the question about BK future, I think every owner with half a brain should NOT offer him a new job as a GM, but I’m pretty sure he will frame someone and get a desk somewhere
regards, keep up the good work !
Update: Billy King is now one of two choices to become the New York Knicks GM. Just proves it’s not what you know (or what you’ve done) but who you know.
Dave - I believe you are right about O’Brien. He is a solid coach but like Larry Brown needs to have a certain type of team and players to be truly successful. From everything I’ve read he was far from a player’s coach and had a very coarse personality. It was 100% business with him and that business was winning basketball games. So he didn’t massage egos or cater much to players or anyone for that matter. That’s tough in a league full of the biggest egos in pro sports. And even worse consider many of those same players often have an influence over the future of a head coach.
O’Brien and Webber have still been feuding in the media this season about their time in Philly.
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