I haven’t been to a Sixers game in a month. Fired up to get back down there and see the team in person. I will be in section 108, row 23 seats 1 & 2. It seems like crowds have been improving from their league-worse attendance earlier in the year. Stringing some wins together will do that.
Beating the hated Celtics in your building, well that will create some excitement as well. Persuade some more fans to the come to the games. But more importantly a win certainly would answer the question indirectly posed by Andre Iguodala’s statement after the debilitating loss to the Nets on Saturday…
It was a terrible loss, one of those that can make or break you — that type of loss. – Andre Iguodala
As a slight aside: I know the saying “make or break you” is fairly common in sports, but I gotta say I don’t want to hear that from any player on the teams I support. I know I’ve personally never subscribed to that thought or used that saying. Losing a game should never break you, regardless of how it occurred. Or anything else for that matter. Everything should be used to make you stronger, a motivator for improvement. The idea that it could break you should never enter the psyche of a player. I am hoping it was just an in-the-moment cliche that didn’t really represent Iguodala’s or the team’s mindset. If it did, that isn’t a good thing by any means.
Bare minimum they need to have a strong showing against Boston without the reigning Defensive Player of the Year. But if they come out and look like they are feeling the lingering effects of Saturday’s loss and get pounded, that will say a lot about the character of this team.
Will that game make or break the Sixers for the rest of the season? Or at least over the next 5 home games going into the All-Star break.
Boston is coming in looking for their 12th straight win. In the first two match-ups this season they have beaten the Sixers by a combined 43 points.
Questions for the Game
- Does/should Elton Brand re-enter the starting line-up?
- Can Dalembert play more than 15 minutes?
- Can Andre Miller defend Rondo on the perimeter and keep track of Eddie House when he enters the game?
- Can Willie Green keep Ray Allen from coming off screens cleanly for open looks?
- Will Louis Williams get into another personal battle with the opposing team’s guard off the bench (House), which could be destructive to team success?
- With KG out, Pierce will look to take a bigger roll offensively (36-8-6 last game). Can Iguodala and Thad keep him in check?
- Who scores consistently for the Sixers against Boston’s very good half-court defense?
- Even without KG, can the Sixers defend well enough and long enough in the half court to win this game?
At some point this team needs to really show us grit. Some mental and physical toughness. Show us they are a real winner. Show us they are more than just a streaky shooter. Right?
This team is just filled with question marks. What questions do you have?
Sixers vs. Celtics Game Notes
I just got home a second ago after driving home in a couple inches of snow after a loss like that. I think you all can imagine the feeling I have right now. It’s late I gotta go to work early. I will write a separate post tomorrow night about this game. But here are a few quick points…
- The Sixers DID NOT do enough to win this game. When you lose it means you didn’t do enough – period.
- Moral victories are for losers and teams not good enough to finish games strong. For anyone talking moral victory check the boxscore and let me know which column they fall under.
- To be honest I could care less about the comeback at this point. Being there and in the moment it was fantastic. There was a ton of energy in the building. But results matter more to me than anything. Allowing 32 and 31 points in the first and fourth quarter is flat out unacceptable. Allowing Ray Allen a clean look to win the game is unforgivable (Thad). To be honest I don’t even know why he was on the floor. I would much rather have had Willie Green chasing Allen around.
- I think the Sixers defense is overrated.
- We need more Reggie Evans’ and Royal Ivey’s on this team. Tough, hard-nosed guys prepared and willing to mix it up. Show a lot of energy, heart and guts to bring the Sixers back almost by themselves. This team is soft and lacks mental toughness.
- I strongly dislike Celtics fans and there were a ton of them at the game tonight.
That’s enough for tonight. Get back at it tomorrow after work.
Next Game: Thursday against the Pacers
Sorry for the re-post but I didn’t want to to get swept away by a new post because of it’s importance.
“Instead, they continue to have Louis Williams, Andre Iguodala and Andre Miller pound the air out of the ball until the clock ticks down to around 12 seconds or less then go to a pick-and-roll which is often ineffective having ball handlers that aren’t real threats to shoot the three”
Dannie you hit the nail on the head. this pattern is killing me. And for a last play why not post up Thad where he only needs to take max one dribble? Thad Young, the kid who I have coined as having “The Unstopable Hook Shot” go to him, it’s a better percentage play then Iggy chucking up pull up jumpers from 20.
Wow I can’t belive that Iggy would say that. Leadership has been his problem the last 2 years since Iverson left. His stank faces, and his constant complaining to the officials has been annoying. This is why we need Brand to step up his game because he does have leadership qualities that Iggy might lack.
I feel the same way, that “unstoppable baby hook” does look like a better option than an iso at the top for IGG. The team has been using it to start the game, why no to try it to close it out when you can’t put the ball in the basket any other way?
I think if Powe or Davis start at the 4, which is almost definite, they should maybe consider starting Brand instead of Thad. I think he’ll have too much trouble keeping those big guys off the offensive glass, and if Boston is getting second chance points there is no way you can beat them. If they want a chance to win they have to rebound well, contain Pierce, run their shooters off the line, and get into the open court. At least it looks like they don’t have to worry about the Big Ticket.
The biggest thing is they have to run constantly. About the only thing that Boston doesn’t do extremely well, is take care of the ball, in fact they are 27th in the league in TOR. The Sixers have to know this and take advantage of it. Even if they do take care of the ball I think they have to run on every posseion to try to keep Boston from setting up the half court D, if this turns into a half court game the Sixers have NO SHOT imo, I mean they could get lucky and play their most efficient 1/2 court game of the season, but I wouldn’t bet on it. KG might be out, but they’re so good because the whole team has bought into a system that a pretty damn good assistant coach has put into place. Not like the Sixers where we need Sam and the bigs to block shots, and IGG and the smalls to get into the passing lanes to be effective.
I hope they just come out and play a solid game, and not get their asses handed to them on their own court by a KG less C’s squad.
BTW – Tony Allen is expected to miss the game as well. I know he is no KG, but he is a solid defender off the bench who can score – Bonus.
When I first read Iguodala’s quote, I was hoping that he would have followed it up with something like “This is a tight group and we won’t fold.”, or “We’ll put it behind us, work hard, and bounce back.”, or “We’ll learn from it and become a better team.” The fact that he didn’t say anything like this makes me wonder if he feels this way at all about the team.
Next I thought maybe he said it intending to leave it out there as a challenge to the team. You know, something like “This is going to go the way we choose, so who is going to step up, work hard, learn from it, and come out stronger on the other side? If we all do that we’ll be a much better team.” I don’t believe this is the case either.
I hope that a lot of these things are being talked about behind closed doors, but I think the quote is what you said, Dannie. Iguodala was probably just at a loss for words and it came out.
Great picture of Wilt, “The Big Dipper!” That’s Bailey Howell,#19, of Mississippi State (Sixer in closing days of career) in left foreground and (face-obscured) Larry Siegfried, #20, of Ohio State ’60 National Champs (teammate of Jerry Lucas, John Havlicek and Bobby Knight) between Wilt’s legs, who Wilt once threw into front row during a bench-clearing scuffle with the flick of his right forearm. Bailey Howell was a good scoring forward (nearly 18, 000 career pts), scrapping “garbageman.” Siegfried was a hustling, versatile 6’3″ guard and general nuisance (antecedent of Danny Ainge) to mid-60s Sixers’ winning plans. Of course #6 is Bill Russell, the greatest team player in the history of sport, winner of 11 championships in 13 seasons!
When present Sixers’ talent quits the “me, me, me, look at me, aren’t I great” stuff and focuses on TEAM GOALS ONLY, with a selfless, ball-moving offense being a derivative of strong team defense, then we’ll have something to get excited about. Until that time, it’s just a frustrating circus of egocentric athletes and unfinished basketball players with no shot at a title. A long way to go.
The Celtics average 11.7 fastbreak points, while only allowing 9.9 fastbreak points a game.
Oddly, they are 5-2 when opposition outscores them by +10 fastbreak points. (Last meeting: Sixers: 20 Celtics: 8)
But still the Sixers need to push the ball, while reducing their turnovers at the same time. If they can do that, they should be able to win the game against a shorthanded Celtics team (Garnett, Scal, Tony Allen).
Also, beware of Eddie House, he has been 24-38 from beyond the arc the last 6 games!!
GO SIXERS!!!
The only way I saw us winning this game about a week ago, is if we get out and run all over them. Much how we won towards the end of the season last year. That win solidified us as a dangerous team.
A win tonight might do that. With KG out, I think the Sixers can play a relatively slow game and still win. (or come very close.) I always have said, one player can not beat you. Example…. Kobe Bryant last night had 61 points but his team only won by 9 against the Knicks. The Knicks would have won, if Pau Gasol did not score 31 along side of Kobe.
Pierce is my “Kobe” tonight. Try as best as you can to contain him, but do NOT let Allen or House to beat you with open 3′s.
I think I said this in my last post… House has done more then shoot a good % his last few games. He has been making a ton of them! Anywhere from 6-8 three point shots in one game.
GO SIXERS
Guest - Or Kobe would have just scored 81 again and Gasol 11 and that would pretty much constitute a single player beating you in my mind. haha
Yet another “inside” Miller to Portland rumor. This time from Sixerfan1976 at RealGM.com (has been a “insider” for a few years. No one is really sure how credible he is, but has had some scoops before.) I posted a blog entry here: http://www.phillyarena.com/archives/2009-02-03/Yet-another-MillerPortland-Trade-Rumor…-tk76
Basically Miller/Evans for Lafrenz/Sergio/Outlaw.
Per Sixerfan, being discussed but in no way imminent.
My last post is still “awaiting moderation” since it contains a link… So basically, yet another “inside” Miller to Portland rumor. This time from Sixerfan1976 at RealGM. com (has been a “insider” for a few years. No one is really sure how credible he is, but has had some scoops before.) I posted a blog entry at Derek Bodner’s blog (click on the tk76 if you want to see the details.)
Basically Miller/Evans for Lafrenz/Sergio/Outlaw.
Per Sixerfan, being discussed but in no way imminent.
Dannie
I stand corrected. One player could in fact beat you. Thankfully Pierce isn’t Kobe. So we shouldn’t have to worry about 81 points haha. Im still standing with my opinion that we should focus more on the players around Pierce.
Young will start again tonight at the four.
“When it looks like the right time, we will (start Brand again),” said DiLeo before the game. “Right now, it’s not. He came off his first back-to-back (Friday and Saturday) and he’s still trying to get into a rhythm.”
Every time I finally get to see my Sixers, it’s a lackluster performance. Where is the fastbreak? We are playing like we have lead in our shoes.
Reggie, you are the man !!!!!!! You are singlehandedly keeping us in the game. Tony, sit L.Will. till he decides to D it up, play Royal please!!!
Where is Speights tonight? No room, with Sammy and Reggie playing well?
Defense at 4th quarter, 1:45 left: We let them get THREE rebounds in a row. The ball is then swung to the high post. Big Baby catches, and a whole SECOND AND A HALF PASSES where all the Sixers stand, looking around frozen like statues, as Big Baby takes his jolly old time winding up a jumpshot, and nailing it, still wide open, cutting our lead to 3.
You’ve got to be @!#$ing kidding me, that is utterly pathetic. Wow. I am so sick of defensive lapses and stupid team defensive mistakes in crunch time. And Pierce just cut it to one…ugh.
not again…
how many times have we lost at the buzzer this year?
Oh man.
Against the Magic, Pacers, Mavericks, Celtics, Spurs.
Wins we coulda woulda shoulda had. And thats not even counting the Denver and Nets game.
When we sit back in our 7th playoff seed playing the Cavs. We are going to wish we had these type of wins.
darn you ray allen!!!!!!!!!
Ray Allen’s 1st three in the last minute: Ok. We all can live with the first three Ray Allen hit around the 30 second mark. Reggie Evans rotated nicely, and not only was he there, but he had his whole arm up in the air. Ray used his quickness to step back, get just enough space, and nail a 3. That’s just a nice pay from Ray, not Reggie’s fault.
Ray Allen’s 2nd three with 0.5 left: I don’t have tivo, but really want to hear people comment that can watch more replays then I’m able. WHAT ON EARTH HAPPENED?! I understand the need to double the penetration (I think Rondo had the ball driving at the top of the key)…but for @!#$’s sake, even if you’re helping on penetration, you DO NOT LEAVE ONE OF THE BEST SHOOTER’S IN THE HISTORY OF THE NBA OPEN IN THE CORNER!!!
Andre Iguodala’s made shot towards the end: I don’t care if this basket went in. This was a HORRIBLY run play, and we got lucky. They moved it to the corner, kicked it to Iggy on the wing. No movement, no screening, everyone just standing there…and yet another isolation move by Iguodala where he just jacked up a wild jumpshot with Pierce’s hands right in his face. This time, he got lucky and hit it. Don’t like this trend.
Defense with 1:45 left to go: I still can’t get over this play haha…the Celtics get THREE rebounds in a row, and Big Baby had time to yawn, stretch, kiss his wife and kids, warm up, and then shoot a made jumpshot. I cannot believe how wide open he was on this play and how long it took our collective team to react. This stuff just makes me punch my couch repeatedly.
How the hell do you leave Ray Allen open when up by 2 for the last shot of the game? This was not like the spurs game which ended with a pure luck shot. This game they deserve to lose due to that terrible defense. If i remember the play correctly Iggy did a good job chasing Paul Pierce off the 3 point line and Thad lets Allen get a wide open look that was awful on top of the Nets game which I did not see and and really glad I didn’t these are two terrible losses in a row.
And another thing I hate are all these scumbag celtics fans where were they three years ago, they make me sick. I might have started a fight if I were at the game glad I didn’t go.
Unlike the Rashard Lewis hedge earlier in the year this was a bad play by Thad, he has to trust his teammates up top and stay with Allen. A spotty effort defensively other than Reggies influence, he seemed, along with Sam and Iggy to be our only players with a set of BALLS.
2one5,
Celtics fans are ridiculous. I agree.
Thats twice that Thad has left his man in the corner to help out. Against Rashard Lewis and Ray Allen.
A couple things make me mad.
1. Iguodala hit a nice shot and I give him credit for that. But he will make that shot 35% of the time. Not necessarily a great late game situation.
2. WHY THE HELL DIDNT SPEIGHTS PLAY MORE? IS THERE SOMETHING IM MISSING?
3. Those three offensive rebounds came when our two best rebounders on the court were Iguodala and Evans. Again. EB? Speights? Sammy? Get a big man in the game. I wouldn’t have even been mad if they put Ratliff in there. Actually that might have been a good move.
Im proud that they played well enough to win against a solid team. But nobody likes Buzzer Beater Losses. Two tough ones.
Thad on Rashard vs. Magic:
The Magic game Thad made the RIGHT play. If you are tied or within a point of each other, you need to do everything possible to prevent any bucket from scored. Whoever had the ball on the Magic (Jameer? A. Johnson? Pietrus?) had already successfully driven the ball past the initial defenders, and was AT the basket. If the offensive player is that close to the hoop, it doesn’t matter whose in the corner, you have to leave for a split second to help out and force the pass. Any sane person would rather a team shoot a 23 foot shot then a 3 foot layup.
Thad on Ray vs. Celtics: This was the wrong play to make. Why? The difference was that the Celtic (Rondo or Pierce?) with the ball at the top of the key…was 18 feet from the basket. In this situation, like another poster said, you have to trust that the individual defender will stay with him. Plus, there is no need to overcomitt THAT much on a drive to the basket from the top of the 3 point line. Especially since we still had a PF/C protecting the basket…why would a wing player commit to helping on a drive at the top of the key?
Thad should have slightly sagged off Ray and stayed closer to the basket, in case Rondo/Pierce did break through and penetrate that far. But no reason to leave a deadeye three ball shooter and multiple time all star that much…he played right into their hands. Penetration causes double teams…we over commit, open 3 in the corner…bham, game over.
I cant stop saying it though…the defensive sequence at 1:45 is still what just killed this game for me. Celtics get three offensive rebounds and a disgustingly wide open jumper.
Alright I’ve calmed down a little, now…
I would like to say Sammy D has shown me a lot lately, his consistent play over the last month has been great, I admire him trying to give it a go againt the nets and we saw we do need him, also he played hard tonight and should have been rewarded with mins down the stretch. I never thought I would post a pro Sammy D post but his has been proving to me he is a valuable member of this team.
I agree the Iggy shot at the end of the game was pretty lucky and not a well run final shot.
Anyone remember where in the world is Carmen Sandiego, well Elton Brand just signed a lucrative contract to replace Ms. Sandiego and is probably on his way to a remote location in a third world country cause he sure as hell isn’t on this team, is he?
Postgame it sounded like Elton may be shut down again, he sounded disgusted, ” I can!t even shoot my little hook shot “, to paraphrase him. Iggy showed me something tonight, he looked like he belongs out there with the best and 2one5 I agree with you about Sam, he seems to have figured it out and has been a major factor.
2one5
Great comparison
Dave T
Your right. Thad made the right play against the Magic. In this play, I dont think the problem is that he helped, I think its that he turned his back against the defender. When helping in that situation, you want to stay parallel with the baseline. Much like he did against the Magic. In this game, he was all turned around and not prepared at all to return to his man.
I have been very UNIMPRESSED with Thad lately. One rebound? Earlier in the season Young was made out to be this future star, future leader of this team. All I see is inconsistency with a good post game. Name another 4 that gets one rebound. There aren’t too many of them out there. He is a good player, but should go back to the bench once EB gets recovered. (or found in 2one5′s case)
This types of losses used to crush me but like the Eagles, the Sixers seem to come up short often. This team is stuck in the mud of mediocrity. The last second loss to Dallas, the meltdown against New Jersey, and now this game. It’s ashame because this team has talent but the are still short on experience and maturity. The games I mentioned where chances for this group to take the next step forward. Regardless of tonight I’m looking forward to some good Sixer teams in the years to come.
I guess Brand’s manzier was not enough to get hm out of his funk. He is 2-13 and looks like a slower Evans out there… no Evans is more efficient on offense right now. We just have to wait for him to get healthy and then hope he can fit. Of course by then Miller will be gone.
I guess I need to man up for calling this as a Sixers win, but this one was ripe for the taking. If anything, the Celtics seemed worse then expected. I thought the Sixers woud come out hot, and I could not have been more wrng. Some players played there way out of there unk, while Thad just kept on strugglling.
Like everyone here, I’m a huge fan of Thad, but even ignoring his horrible shooting and continued inabilty to close out on pure shooters… 1 rebound in 37 minutes from the startingg PF. That is beyond brutal and absolutely unnacceptable.
Hit even a few of the easy misses tonight- esp the ones in the 1st half- and theis game would not have been close. The Celtics brought there B game.
As George Carl said when the Nuggets stole one from the Sixers… Sometimes good teams find a way to win and bad teams find a way to lose. Harsh words, but the Celtics are by far the better team, and were able to beat the Sixers even though they honestly did not play well at all.
The Sixers are 3-6 in games decided by three points or less. That is where we have to work harder on. Not every game is going to be all “peaches and cream” as one former Sixer put it. Our most recent losses have been heartbreakers. I hope we as a young team mature and learn from this and hopefully become last year’s Trailblazers when faced in situations like that.
Thank God for our Energy Crew: Reggie Evans, Marresse Speights, and Royal Ivey. They brought us back in the game in the 2nd quarter and gave us a huge jolt in the 4th quarter. To me it seems that the Sixers are never out of a game and that it is hard to blow this team by 20+. They never give up and that is our best attribute!
Now, we need to encorporate Donyell Marshall and Kareem Rush in our rotations, especially towards the end of quarters. The Celtics have faith in guys like Eddie House, who plays little to no defense, but he shoots the lights out. At least use them as decoys, if it is a 2 pointer we need. This is where we need them in games decided by three points or less!!! I hope coach DiLeo reads this. Luckily things can be writed as we are still in 7th place!!
We should consider a 10 man rotation. What would the rotation be if you were the coach the next three games?
Thaddeus Young needs to stop overhelping!! Not just him, but everyone else. Our double-teams are not very effective. They need to trust one another and communicate BETTER on the defensive end. Only Reggie Evans, Royal Ivey, and a little sprinkling of Elton Brand have been effective in the double teams. Our frontcourt players, with the exception of Speights and Smith, are tremendous one-on-one defenders. They find themselves in trouble when their teammates are overhelping. (one instance where Ivey was trying to swat the ball and was called for a bailout foul, one of our frontcourt players was doing just fine on Powe or Davis, that one possession).
Our Free Throw Shooting got us back in!! It better stay that way the rest of the season, especially in close games!!
Is it just me or was this a mirror image of the Lakers-Spurs game down the stretch? After Iggy made the jumper, he did a goofy dance similar to his buddy Kobe. Then Ray Allen hit the game winning three, similar to Roger Mason hitting that three. The result– a one point loss, like that for the Lakers.
This is a moral victory, even though the Celtics played without Garnett!!
You are right about the over helping. Its been part of the problem all year- and its been a big issue for Thad. remember he is only 20, and still has to improve on his defense to get to the place where he does the rightthing on instinct. At last this is correctable.
I do not think there can be a 10 or 11 man rotation. That was part of the problem Mo had. DiLeo has been better at tightening his bench rotation and defining roles.
I think we won’t be seeing Brand for a while- at least through the AllStar break. I wonder if Miller will still be on the team.
No doubt, Thad Young had the worst game of his career. Wow, that was ugly, forget all the missed shots, and the lack of rebounding, how can he leave the best 3-point shooter in the league wide open with the game on the line, and the 3-ball is the only thing that can beat you, that’s not too bright.
And another thing, all these switches on defense have got to go! It does nothing but create mismatches and open looks. I don’t know if anybody knows who they’re suppose to be guarding, you’ve have centers defending guards 20 feet from the basket, and guards defending centers two feet from the basket, it’s crazy. I know they want to trap and overplay the passing lanes, in order to create turnovers and start their fastbreak, but, it isn’t working. For every turnover they get, they give up many more open looks, or bad mismatches that lead to easy baskets. A good passing team (Jazz), tears them apart.
And while I’m venting just let me say a little about the offense. There is way too much one-on-one. Where are the cutters, where is the ball movement? I had such high hopes for Tony but this is the same style of play that we had under Mo, and it’s not working! Tony needs to make some fundamental changes to our schemes, at both ends of the floor.
LA Steve: Agree completely when you said: “Way too much one on one. Where are the cutters, where is the ball movement?” Which is why I cannot wait until Avery or EJ is here. My preference is Avery, but EJ will make a fine hire as well.
Granted, I’m a bit bias in that I think the majority of NBA defenses rely FAR too much on isolation plays, and not enough on team work and ball movement. People might knock me for this, but I really do think players in the late 90′s – 00′s are less skilled and far less team oriented then those in the early 90′s, 80′s and earlier.
Go back and watch any ESPN classic games, especially regular season ones where they mean less, and in these it’s amazing how much better the passing is, how much better the midrange jumpshot is, how players look for each other more, their chemistry is better. You could make the argument defenses are FAR better today, and this is true…but man. I am so sick of NBA players in today’s game standing around, taking a few dribbles and settling for a jumpshot.
Iguodala is a prime example of this. By all accounts a great guy, hard worker, and is obviously talented, is athletic as hell, and has all the tools to be a great NBA defender and true versatile offensive player in the halfcourt. But after five years in the league, it’s still all POTENTIAL, and he is still more of an athlete that is capable of great bball IQ, that seems too impatient to use it.
If I see Iguodala take one more out of control drive to the basket, get nervous and antsy when he sees no other teammates are open, and shoots up an “off one leg, off balance, sometimes turnaround or fading away” contested jumpshot, my poor couch will be abused some more from punches. (I should note, I don’t mean him in the Celtics game in particular, this is just me being frustrated with one on one play in the NBA, and using him as an example. I have and always will be an Iggy fan).
Rob…if you see this as a moral victory, you were watching a different game then I was. If the Celtics had their trio healthy, and we played tough and gave them a run but lost (like Charlotte has in the past), thats a moral victory. But going up against a Pierce/Allen led Celtics team, letting Rondo get in the paint at will, not rotating in crunch plays, and HAVING THE GAME IN OUR HANDS BUT STILL LOSING solely do to lack of execution…plus the fact our “face of the franchise 80 million player” only played 10 minutes…plus the fact Iguodala got all cocky after a horribly run ISO play where he got lucky and hit a contested shot…I don’t see much moral victory in any of this especially coming off that tough Nets loss.
(Rob don’t mean to sound like an ass there…I’m just pissed tonight. The slow boil of my frustration with this team kinda popped the lid watching tonight’s finish, didnt mean to take that out on you there).
This from Kate Fagan:
Both Sports Center and NBA Fastbreak have spent a good deal dissecting the last play in slow motion as well…painful to watch.
…and there’s Yahoo! Sports NBA frontpage photograph: Ray Allen in the air poised to release his perfect form 3 point shot, with Thad Young flailing around five feet away from him.
Between this loss and Jameer Nelson’s injury earlier today…not a great day for Philly sports.
Jameer Nelson: On the 1% chance you read this: have the surgery right now and get it over with, take the rest of the year off. You proved everyone wrong, hit all star status and proved you are an NBA caliber starting PG. Don’t go and screw things up by trying to play hero and coming back too soon…go under the knife, let the shoulder heal 100%, work your butt off in the offseason and keep taking hundreds of jumpers with Patrick Ewing…and come back in 09-10 ready to pick up right where you left off.
I have read this blog for sometime and enjoy it. I go to about 30 games a year at the Boston game I sat in amazement in the first quarter Lou Williams had 2 points AI had 2 points and Brand had 0 points I feel this game should had have a better outcome if anyone of these players would man up The Sixers seem to dig there self a hole somewhere in the game a then need to come back or hold off a come back AI”s shot tonight was awlful straight up and know touch They need to get back and be consistent with ther shooting This Boston game should have been a win
Thad did have a strange game last night, but from my perspective, the Celtics won because Doc Rivers coached those last six seconds better than Tony DeLeo. With few exceptions, Thad hasn’t been much on D, and any toughness overall has been there rarely. That said, what really made the Allen 3-pointer was Big Baby Davis setting that Big Baby pick on Thin-Legged Thad. Young didn’t merely lose his place on the floor. He got hung up for a second on Davis and that was all Allen needed. But Young shouldn’t have been out there in the first place.
It is odd that every time we play the damn Celtics, it is Reggie who provides the spark. It is inexplicable to me how the 76ers could look so slow at the beginning of the game. Thank you Reggie. But if DeLeo sees that he is getting nothing from Green and Young early, he needs to get Williams AND Speights involved much sooner.
If this team is going to make any noise in the post-season, it has to win games like this. I’m sick of hearing it from my friends up here who root for the Celtics. On a good night, we can beat this team, especially when KG is back in Boston.
Bummer.
TK76 – I had planned to use that exact quote in my upcoming post. That was some bullshit right there. Way to not take responsibility for not only terrible defensive technique but terrible defensive judgment. He was burned and wants to pass blame. Loser comment right there.
Not a good sign coming out of a Young player who I already think is a cupcake. Just man up and move on.
If that is the phylosophy, having the big man leave the basket area to switch out on jumpshooters, than it has to change. If you have a small group out than that is okay, otherwise let the big stay at home.
Yes, this was a tough loss to take, but it was still a great game. Both Miller and AI hit clutch shots, only to have Allen nail a fade away three. That’s a money shot. That’s what makes the sport exciting. There’s nothing I hate more than seeing us lose to the C’s but fact is, it was a battle that they won, and not one that we gave away.
I agree, Steve, that you cannot switch late in a game like that. It is just too risky because if somebody cheats a little in the wrong direction (Young) he cannot get back. DiLeo should’ve had Young stay with Allen regardless of what happens — especially when Allen drifts to the corner, which is his favorite spot. A well-designed play by Doc Rivers and countered poorly by the Sixers.
I thought Iguodala’s comments were on the mark for the second game in a row. This time, he said, “It’s kind of crazy and hard to stomach how he got that open. We talked about it before. We knew the play was coming. We thought we had it, but we just didn’t do it.”
Iguodala also didn’t think Boston trailing for 11:59.5 of the fourth quarter wasn’t any kind of moral victory.
“We should’ve won the game and we lost. They didn’t have one of their Hall of Famers, so there’s no excuse.”
I didn’t have a problem with the switching on the final play. It is a risky move, but with 6 seconds on the clock and no Garnett on the floor it was unlikely the ball was going inside. The problem with switching is the mismatch it creates. Any you look at it though, this was just a systemic breakdown of team defense.
Dannie, I’m glad you pointed out that moral victories amount to little in the NBA. I’m tired of talking about hanging in agaisnt good teams. All that tells us is the Sixers can’t finish games or beat the better teams in the league on a consistent basis. Tough loss to swallow.
Iguodala rattles home a 19 ft. jumper that was released from his palm and then does a ridiculous “look what I just did” hands & body gyration downcourt. Was that a demonstration of simple joy? Or contemptuous derision of an opponent (with 6 seconds remaining!) following unusual personal late-game success? Not sportsmanlike, not wise. Tough loss for team, but Allen’s shot was what Iguodala deserved. He’s playing better with DiLeo as coach, but he’s still a screwball.
Disagree with you, Tom, about the accuracy of Iguodala’s recent post-game remarks. A shocking, giveaway loss (Nets) doesn’t “make or break” any decent team in a long 82 game regular season - - a case of one player and a throwaway, hyperbolic quip. As for last night: “We should’ve won the game [subtext: I made the shot] and we lost … it’s kinda crazy and hard how he got that open [subtext: I did my job, someone else didn't] … we thought we had it, we [obviously, Young] just didn’t do it.” Accessible spokesperson, yes. Strong leader, no. Lessons still to learn.
Iguodala was the Sixer who most spoke what was on his mind after the last two losses. I agree that he was blaming others (namely Young and Dalembert) for Allen being so open.
As for the “make or break” comment, remember the loss to the Pacers on a Stephen Jackson layup late in Cheeks’ first season? The Sixers never recovered from it. Too many losses in the closing seconds — that’s four in about a month — can affect a team’s confidence.
Maybe Iguodala said all the right things after the game, but I don’t know that I like DiLeo’s comments:
“That was a great game,” Sixers coach Tony DiLeo said with too much tinge of a moral victory. “I was proud the way our team came back. We got back in the game and pretty much controlled the game, especially down the stretch.”
“I’m proud of the team and the way they played against the champions,” DiLeo said. “We had control of the game. We just have to get a little better at finishing every game off, especially when we have the lead coming down the stretch.”
DiLeo might be trying to bolster and maintain the team’s confidence. I get that, up to a point. What bothers me is that these quotes make it sound as though DiLeo actually believes that with just a little more determination, concentration, or whatever we will be able to handle the best in the league. I don’t see that at all.
I’m not saying that DiLeo should hammer the team, especially to the media. It’s just that the daily affirmations get tiresome after a while. I’d like to hear a bit more accountability and expectation of performance as well as a greater sense of urgency. Maybe it’s going on behind closed doors unbeknownst to us. I hope so because I’m getting tired of waiting for the sun to come out tomorrow.
Tom – While agree loses like that can and do affect a team’s confidence and subsequent results in the standings the point is they shouldn’t. They affect weak minded players and immature teams that are not mental tough.
Let’s hope the Sixers don’t succumb.
Depressed fan has a really good breakdown of the last shot, and where the defense broke down (really all on Thad unfortunately, but he’s only 20.)
I linked to Brian’s post. if you want to se it click on tk76 above.
Tom, Most spoke what was on his mind? … you would know that better than I. But how much were the other minds on the team probed by reporters after the 2 losses? Maybe the herd of reporters should be more creatively enterprising and get different points of view for public consumption. I’m sure some of the the lesser lights or secondary players have interesting things to say, if given the forum. By watching TV snippets, Green strikes me as more forthcoming and direct in reply to questions. Miller, though laconic, gives honest, no BS replies too.
I would’ve liked to have heard from Ivey and Evans after last night’s game. Maybe there’s protocol in place which limits access that I’m not privy to.
Affect confidence, yes. “Make or break,” hardly.
I’m anxious to see what Brand’s situation is. Back when he first injured his shoulder, I remember reading that sometimes rest and rehab doesn’t do the trick and that Brand may end up needing surgery anyway. I wonder if we are at that point now. Maybe surgery would be the best option now. I’d hate to see Brand keep repeating this pattern of taking a few weeks off, coming back, experiencing difficulty, and taking time off again. Who knows how long that could drag out. Worst case, it could affect next season and beyond. We’re not tearing up the league with him as it is, so he should do whatever he needs to do to get back to 100% and we’ll just deal with it.
Of course that still leaves us with the mess of the upcoming trade deadline, Andre Miller, what do we need, whom should we acquire, who fits with whom, etc…
The shot doesn’t need much breakdown. They lost for the same reason they have lost past games in this fashion. They put themselves in situations where their opponents (who have better offensive players) have the ball in their hands to win. They have showed an ineptness to get game winning stops. Lucky shot by Parker, tough shots by Dirk and Ford or easy strolls down the line by Kenyon Martin. The results are all the same LOSS.
Regardless of who is to blame the problem is this team’s lack of individual accountability and leadership to man up and take responsibility on themselves. AKA losers mentality.
I think we still miss a SG like Allen Iverson for close games like that. we had that luxury of having him going one-on-one against a defender, crosses over that defender and hits the game winning jumper. Iverson would do his thing in the 4th quarter and that would be that. We are a starting SG away from making a huge jump. (aka Cavaliers- Mo Williams).
The team needs to get a full year in their belt and Brand gets a full sense of the team. Then perhaps this team can do much better next season if you really want to see that full jump or improvement.
Depending on Brand’s health, I would prefer Thaddeus coming off the bench with the hustle players. He really fits there and is at his best when he scores in the paint as opposed to settling for jump shots and threes. Thad needs to drive more to the basket. When he does that as well as sticks his noise in the paint, the Sixers win a lot of games.
Again, the Sixers have to find some time for Rush and Marshall. We have been struggling from beyond the arc and maybe they can give us some confidence from that department. Our recent success came when we were hitting threes from dribble penetration.
The Pacers game tomorrow will be another close game, like the last two meetings. Both teams will make huge runs, but it comes down to stops. Something has to give. In the win at Indiana, Thaddeus was HUGE!!
Luckily, though, we are in the East and there is still time to make amends to get that higher seed. Also, tonight the Heat play the Pistons in Detroit, something is bound to shift in the standings. We play the Heat on Saturday. That should be a playoff type of game.
JJG,
I disagree. Iguodala was celebrating after he hit a tough shot. The crowd was going crazy and I too would be very pumped up after hitting that shot.
Kobe was on the road when he hit his shot. I think Kobe was saying look what I just did to the Spurs crowd. Kobe just absolutely hates the Spurs.
I still think Iguodala was just excited for his team getting the lead back. As for the postgame comments, I dont really have an opinion. Either way I am more interested in how they will respond than what they think about the past games.
Guest/JJG – It’s about acting like you expected that outcome. Like this is just me doing my job. Not like you just won the NBA championship. I simple fist pump would and moderate celebration with teammates is all that is necessary from a professional basketball player in my opinion.
Occasional outburst is OK, but Dala has started to show a trend when the rare chance he makes a tough, clutch shot occurs.
But you know what, chalk it up to the fact that he never has been (in college) or will be a real superstar player in this league. Look at those guys reaction after similar and more important shots.
I guess this loss just hurt more than most- or at least brought to surface the combined pain of the Sixers and Eagles losses.
I don’t mind when a team either gets lucky or hits a tough shot (Parker and Dirk.)
But, if down 2 I give you one shot to win, in the history of the NBA is there any better choice then Ray Allen for a 3 in the corner, with no defender within 8 feet?
When the defense gives up the one play that would be best option in the history of the NBA, you made a big mistake. Thad’s apparent passing the blame to Sam makes this more frustrating.
Thad is 20 and will improve, but he can’t go blaming his teammates.
Dannie,
If you think about it, Iguodala has come a long way from his putback shot against the Timberwolves when he was a rookie (he might have been in his second year, not sure). After that play he stormed down the court jumping up and down. Thats what you call an outburst haha.
I agree that acting in that manner is not “superstar” like, but the way I see it, he was just having some fun. He should have waited until the buzzer sounded though.
Oh yeah, tk76, after examining the last play… It is very clear Thad just lost his man. There are no excuses for that. Hopefully he will in fact learn.
Gee wiz that was a tough loss. The only way they lose the game is on a 3 point shot so why aren’t they defending the 3 instead of worrying about dribble penetration. Sam was in the game if nothing else he’s there to protect the basket. Stay with all shooters and force them to shoot over you. This switching and rotating was bad with cheeks. I guess with the same coaching staff the ineptness continues. No one seems to know how to fix this problem.
People, even myself, forget how many young players we have. In fact, they are younger than most of us! They are the growing pains, but at the same time we are learning and are again in a chance to make the playoffs again. Normally young players + playoffs do not go in the same sentence. They will learn. Even though we and Ed don’t like to use the word– but patience is required (for the young guys).
The Sixers must learn to handle close games. Plain and simple. Generally, uptempo teams do not thrive well in close games– (Suns, Pacers, Hawks, Warriors, Nuggets, and to some extent LA Lakers). That is why we signed Brand to handle that half-court pressure. The truth is the team needs a full year under their belt in order to really reach the elite (assuming we resign Miller).
Let’s not forget about the Knicks as another uptempo team.
In other news, Elton Brand might play Thursday:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3884436
Brand had an MRI Wednesday and it showed the shoulder continues to get better. He is expected to be available vs. the Pacers. He was not at practice and unavailable to the media.
Had an interesting chat with Ed Stefanski about Elton Brand this afternoon. He blames injuries for Brand not being as effective as the Sixers had hoped.
“Coming off a major surgery (ruptured Achilles tendon in 2007), he was progressing nicely in our eyes,” Stefanski said. “It’s a shame for Elton and the team he has not been healthy enough. Obviously, people can read into whatever they want, but that’s how we do.
“The fans are going to grow restless because their expectations are high. There’s nothing we can do about it. He hasn’t really had a chance. We haven’t been able to envision what we saw this summer.”
Tom: Thanks for the updates.
In other news, I love me some Thad, but he sure is having a sophomore slump. I can only reiterate what others have said about his horrible play at the end of the game.
When you gamble in signing a player coming off an injury sometimes you win and sometimes you lose.
The Phillies made out exceedingly well with Brad Lidge. The Sixers have not come remotely close to that success with Brand, even before the separated shoulder.
As far as risk taking, one key difference is that the Phillies were only committed to Lidge for one year, thus somewhat hedging their bet, while the Sixers committed 5 years and $80 mil to Brand.
The way things are going, it sure looks like year 1 with Brand is going to be a washout. At this point, my hope is that he is back at full strength next season and we start getting what we paid for.
bski: At this point, I would shut down Brand until after the All Star break. I thought he was coming around, but the past 2 games have been big setbacks.
Can we make a freakin trade or what? What the hell are we going to do with Andre Miller? Play Speights!
Agreed Morty. I’ll even go further and say that Brand should do whatever needs to be done (more rest and rehab, surgery, whatever) and stay out as long as needed (even if it’s for the remainder of this season) for him to get back to full strength.
If we are truly committed to this guy for 4 more years, I’d like him to be at 100%, and giving us max production, for as much of that time as possible.
As I said earlier, I’m concerned that this cycle of sitting out for rest and rehab, coming back only to find he’s not at full strength yet, and then sitting out some more could possibly continue indefinitely, which would be to no one’s benefit.
Blski, does Brand
!s situation affect what we do with Miller at the deadline ?
bski: Yes, why not. 5 years and 80 mil is a big investment, and if making year 1 a washout makes the other 4 year successful, then I would make that trade.
Suede: I think Stefanski has to be able to find value for Miller. Personally, I’m hoping there is truth to the Portland rumors, and that we’ll be able to pry Fernandez from them
Dannie, Totally agree with your post #56 1st paragraph opinion. An 80 million player should act like he’s been there, even if he seldom has.
While Thad blew last assignment, Iguodala didn’t exactly distinguish himself as a good defender on that play either. Came running full speed at Pierce after getting distanced off interference on low right side block area. Responding smartly, after catching pass, Pierce dribbled left towards lane with a half-step edge on an unbalanced Iguodala. Thad reflexively took the bait and slid one stride towards middle to help; had no chance then to skirt big body Davis and prevent or distract Allen corner shot. If Dileo gave him Allen as an assignment on last play, it should’ve beened drummed into Young’s head during timeout - FORGET ALL OTHERS, WHATEVER YOU DO, DON’T LEAVE HIM.
Jumpin, couldn!t agree with you more, Sammy is there to help in the paint, so Thad shouldv!e stayed put. Morty, I would be open to a new p.g. if he can defend like Rondo or Ivey. I am not sure what we get back from Portland [Outlaw and Blake ?]
The “inside scoop” yesterday from SF1976 said they were discussing Miller/Evans for Outlaw/Sergio(Spanish Chocolate)/Lafrenz +/- conditional pick.
Not a great haul, but I doubt they would be able to get Rudy for Miller- esp since it could end up as only a rental. On the other hand, essentially flipping Evans for Outlaw/Sergio gets rid of a horrible contract for 2 guys who fit this scheme and have trade value.
Of course its hard to trade Evans after his G.O.A.T. performance last night (Greatest of all time.)
I like Bayless. Did anyone watch the Blazers vs. Hornets game? Bayless completely took over while Roy was on the bench having a horrible game. He is athletic and can get to the rim with ease.
I know we have a lot of those players, but it seems like he can fit into the fast paced system. I am very impressed with this rookie.
Like Rudy, Bayless is probably not available. He was a lottery pick, and they see him as their PG in 2 years (maybe after Miller?)
In order to get Rudy or Bayless the Sixer would probably have to add in a real player like Speights- which would not really work for either team.
Portland can sign Miller this Summer. Right now they are looking for a 3 month rental, and they are not going to give up long term pieces for that. Most likely Blake, Outlaw and Sergio are the options coming back (as well as them taking on a bad salary like Evans or Green.)
JJG,
Disagree with your assessment in Post #71 about Iguodala’s defense on the last play, unless you are faulting him for getting screened. After the screen, he HAD to come at Pierce full-speed to prevent a 3-point attempt. Falling a half-step behind was a small price to pay for preventing the 3 attempt. Poor Thad, meanwhile, should have had blinders on, like some of the horses wear (“Allen Blinders”: look at Allen, only at Allen).
DiLeo today on Brand: “We’re still working him into the lineup. We’re not thinking about Elton shutting down (because of the shoulder).”
Would’ve liked to see Iguodala drive on Pierce after Pierce picked up his second foul in the second quarter and before Rivers could get him out of the game. Instead, Iggy launched a long jumper. Why not try to get No. 3 and make Pierce sit the rest of the half?
Reggie makes sense in Portland. They are lacking in the toughness category AND if we trade him, so will we. I would think that trade is doable from both sides. The question I’d have is what is Rodriguez’s upside?
Spanish Chocalate’s upside is probably only Jason Williams (White Chocolate) without the jumpshot.
Sorry, I do not make up these ridiculous nicknames.
Don’t think that’s good enough.
I’m not that interested in Rodriguez, as he does not have a 3 point shot either. Outlaw is a nice shooter, but redundant, being yet another SF. Portland would have to come up with a really nice draft pick to interest me in that deal. Fernandez or bust out of Portland!
Blake is very similar to Hinrich, above average defender and real good 3 pt. shooter and if the Thad/Iggy experiment at the 2 and 3 is not done with Outlaw would be great as a 6th man type.
Morty, It’s Bayless or Fernandez OR bust with a Portland deal.
jjg: I also disagree with you about Igoudala on the last play. He took away the 3 point shot, and funneled Pierce towards Dalembert waiting in the lane. The fault, in my eyes, lies solely with Thad.
I thought Iggy played a real good game, its just a shame they only show defensive energy in spurts.
Actually, I’m impressed with Blakes stats. Shoots .438 from field and 3 pt shots and he rarely turns the ball over. He would provide a good compliment with Lou Will and Ivey. Start Iggy at the 2 spot. Plus this trade would benefit our cap situation big time. It works on trade machine. Willie & Andre for Blake & LaFrentz. He also would be an upgrade on defense at the point. I’d consider that but I think Portland would prefer Reggie over Willie in a deal.
If you look at it from Portlands perspective, why do they do a deal for Miller when they seem to run the offense through Roy. Blake and Bayless and Fernandez can all catch and shoot. What good is A.Miller without the ball in his hands. By the way, Minn. is winning and has moved Foye to the 2 guard spot, I still think they are a better fit for A.Miller [Telfair ?] if draft picks and expiring contracts are E.S.!s goal.
Don’t think Minny wants rent a player. Andre might stay with Portland or help them this year in a big playoff run; Not so sure about Minny.
Blake’s best role could be off the bench once we fill Andre’s void with a young guard. I’d prefer getting that young player in a trade.