Do you know the last time the Sixers won their 4th straight game? 46 games ago on March 19th, 2008 against the Denver Nuggets. That’s a long ass time and tonight is set up nicely for the Sixers to break that streak.
Indiana will be without Danny Granger, Troy Murphy and Marquis Daniels all hit with the flu bug. Indiana is coming off a ridiculous double overtime loss last night in which T.J. Ford, Brandon Rush and Jarret Jack played a combined 141 minutes. Not to mention the Sixers are at home. The stars are aligned. If the Sixers run them to death the Pacers very well could pack it in early.
Two things can spoil the Sixers attempt at 4 in a row.
- Rebounding, especially on the defensive end
- Three-point shooting defense
Indiana is starting two centers in Roy Hibbert and Jeff Foster. If they pull down a lot of offensive boards not only will it give the Pacers second shot opportunities but it could stall the fast break as well. We all know O’Brien likes his teams to put up their fair share of threes and if the Sixers perimeter defense isn’t up to snuff the Pacers can get hot for deep.
Take care of those two areas and the Sixers should be able to make easy work of this Pacers team without three of their top four scorers.
Sixers vs. Indiana Game Notes
I am beyond pissed off right now. The Sixers couldn’t beat a 9-man roster of scrappy Pacers playing without 3 of their best players and coming off a physically and emotionally draining loss the night before. But at the end of the game it was the Sixers that looked a bit sluggish especially on the defensive end. Their rotations slowed down and they simply couldn’t get that winning stop at the end of the game.
Here are a few thoughts and observations.
0-8 from three point range. Look you don’t have to be the best three point shooting team to be a winning ball club but it starts to get pretty hard to win when you are consistently the worst. The Sixers sit comfortably at the bottom of the league in three point shooting for the second straight year.
Clearly new coach Dileo hasn’t figured out going to Andre Iguodala in isolation situations at the end of games is not a winning strategy. Four possession he had at the end of the game:
- Turns the ball over firing a pass at the rim
- Drives directly into a trap on the baseline and throws a pass between multiple defenders in the paint. The ball was deflected and luckily for Iguodala it lands in Sammy’s hands and he is fouled
- Drives in the lane gets stuck, loses the ball and gets a lucky bounce back to him for an easy layup – he actually made it too.
- Misses a left hand floater in traffic (Are you telling me that is the best shot you got to win a game? A damn fading floater with your weak hand?)
Look Iguodala had a decent game. 26 points on 9-19 shooting, 8-8 from the line, 6 dimes, 6 boards and 2 steals. But the same problems persists, dude had 5 freakin’ turnovers and continues to come up lame at the end of games. Not to mention DiLeo put him on T.J. Ford at the end of the game up 1 and needing a single stop. He couldn’t get it. Ford saw the match up, waived Jeff Foster away who was coming up for a ball screen and took Iguodala one-on-one for the game winning bucket. Lock down defender my ass. Did Ford make a relatively tough shot? Sure, he had been knocking that jumper down all second half. But in that spot I found myself wanted a big play from $80 mil on defense, a winning play and as usual I was left disappointed with this dude.
On a positive note, Andre Miller looks to be in mid season form now. Have you noticed his energy level and quickness are at peak levels after a sluggish start. His hesitation with the dribble and ability to get easy baskets have kept the Sixers in games. Tonight he has a perfect floor game finishing with a triple double: 14 points, 12 assists and 10 boards and NO TURNOVERS.
Speights looked great again with 12 points, 4 boards and 4 blocks on 6-11 shooting. I have no idea why he doesn’t get more post up opportunities.
Sammy did what we wish he would do every game. Rebound and defend. 11 points, 14 boards, 5 blocks and countless other alterations in the paint.
The Sixers almost did enough to win this game. They out-rebounded the Pacers, had 24 assists on 35 made field goals, 9 blocks, 7 steals and an 18-4 advantage in fastbreak points. But the underlying flaw in this team that I have talked about before is the lack of a killer instinct. This team simply doesn’t know how to put teams away early or finish them late. They had the Pacers down 15 in the second quarter and could have made this one a laugher. Just put their foot on the depleted Pacers throat and crush ‘em. Nope. That’s something a good basketball team does. A winning basketball team. Right now the Sixers continue to be losers.
Next game: Tuesday at Boston who will likely be on an 18 game winning streak.
P.S.
Much respect to the Pacers for not quiting and showing some mental toughness to pull this game out. They got payback tonight.
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Continued from last thread…….
Suede….You are right about problems 1 and 2 with Sam. When I said that, I should have emphasized is, as in Sammy could be as long as he is Ben Wallace, because that is exactly what I meant. Since he is not, specifically because of the problems you mentioned, I don’t see us winning a title with him.
Zack….Good point about the 2nd unit. This year we have several new guys (and a few subtractions). It really hasn’t come together (maybe because of the odd substitutions and combos, the irregular minutes given out, or the fact that some can’t seem to get on the floor at all.). Whatever the reason, hopefully DiLeo will settle on a core group and give them regular minutes so that they can get comfortable and more productive.
Here is Kareem Rush’s opportunity. Make some shots and get in that regular rotation.
Suede, you must be thrilled with JMc getting burn for the Pacers. He’s looking every bit of 6′7″. Love his blank stares time after time when things don’t go his way. He better enjoy this opportunity. Won’t last long.
Love Freddy Mercury. Wish he was on our team.
Sucks!
Despicable
WTF
Why did we put Iguodala on Ford? I wasnt able to watch it. Would we not want to put Lou on him, and match speed with speed?
I can deal with losing close games, that does not make me mad. But we had this thing lined up perfectly for us to win.
The reason I think that Iggy is lame in late game situations, is that he is a bit predictable. He does not have the speed nor crossover to get seperation on jumpshots, and he does not have the speed to get seperation in the lane.
Everyone is right, they should not ISO him. But im not complaining if he takes the last shot. He was having the best game shooting wise, just under 50%, but I do not like to clear him out. Why not have a pick and roll with him and Sammy? We obviously can not shoot, so we should try to open up the key and create seperation with our most athletic player going to the rim. I may be retarded and that may be a horrible game plan so just tell me if I am, but a left handed floater isn’t getting it done.
Once again, I didn’t watch it, but where was Thad? 2 rebounds, 1 assist, no free throws, not 3 point shots.
On a happy note, we got Speights involved with 11 shot attempts, he is coming on strong.
But credit the Pacers, they played tough, and they lead the lead in games decided by 6 points or less. So they are a tough team. (They actually made a game winning shot unlike last time we played them.)
Guest – Pick and roll with Sammy and all I do is double Iguodala and leave Sammy open as the guy he must pass too. Do you like that situation now? If you want to do a pick and roll it needs to be with a big that can shot a wide open shot either Speights or bring Marshall in like they did against Detroit.
Just because Lou is quick doesn’t mean he can play defense. Two plays before he was defending Jarret Jack and Jack was able to get in the lane for a nice turnaround shot to give the Pacers the lead. The next possession they put Miller a bigger defender than Lou on Jack and he tried to do the same thing and Miller forced him into a turnover that lead to Lou Williams getting a wide open fastbreak layup to put the Sixers up one.
Next possession DiLeo thinking the big defender idea worked last time so he put Iguodala (remember he is suppose to be a lock down defender) on Ford thinking best case he blocks or completely takes the shot away. Instead Ford drove hard a couple dribbles right and Iguodala gave too much space he pulled up and nailed a tough – but not THAT tough jumper. I was ok with that decision, Iguodala just didn’t get the stop. DiLeo very well could have brought Ivey in the game for that possession as another option since Willie Green was unavailable having sprained his ankle.
Thad was doing what I said he does in my comment on the previous post when he is at the PF position. Roam around the perimeter being too damn passive with no plays run for him even though HE HAD JEFF FREAKIN’ FOSTER GAURDING HIM. He was going to have a tough time rebounding tonight defending Foster who is a solid rebounder on both ends but he didn’t get ONE play run for him when Foster was on him.
Guest the reason I HATE close loses is because it is the mark of team that lacks mental toughness. A team with no go-to player. A team with no killer instinct or mental toughness in pressure situations. Frustrating.
Ok, I understand all of your points now. Your right, a pick and roll with Sammy would be bad. But does that mean any pick and roll with Iggy having the ball, wouldn’t work if we want Iggy to take the last shot? I guess that option is out.
I saw the highlights. That left hand shot was close to going in, but still not a great shot. The shot by Ford was a nice shot, but like you said, Iggy could have played better D. I guess their gaurds match up perfectly against our gaurds.
The thing that frustrates me about this game, is that I can not put my finger on the one thing that killed us. I guess it’s like you said…Mental toughness. (which Iggy isn’t showing he has right now, but the 26 points was very promising, we need him to score points without Brand.)
p.s. I think I just saw that Brand does not needs surgery and will be out a month. Good News….Maybe
Guest – Turnovers continue to be a killer for the Sixers they had 16 against tonight and the Pacers converted them into 21 points.
You can run the pick and roll with Iguodala as long as he has a player he can pass the ball to that can make a shot. The other thing is the opposing coach may decide to take away the drive and just go under the screen forcing Iguodala to make jump shot with a hand in his face. If that pick is set pass the three point line we would be looking at him taking a three to win a game. Not sure I like that outcome either.
lmao at losing to a team that gave josh mcroberts & travis diener significant minutes. these guys should be ashamed losing to a depleted team like this. i haven’t left the wachovia center this angry in years. just beyond pathetic.
guest “Floater” suggests shooting touch and ‘teardropping the cone’ in some way, at least it does to me. Iguodala maneuvered for a right side drive, reverse-spinning middle to the lane, for an out-of-control left-handed brick (he’s ambidextrous that way) that had no chance unless it banked off the board. After minor contact with a helping, smartly anticipating Foster, he yanked his off-balance 8 ft. throw wide right. Expensive L.
According to Dei Lynam’s post-game wisdom, due to Pacers’ undermanned situation, it was a “trap” game and the hometowners’ rather naturally succumbed to the lure. Sounds like a rationalization to me … from the daughter of the team’s senior assistant coach.
I prefer to applaud T.J. Ford for doing most everything right down the stretch, making big shot after big shot. Impressive. Just as he was with Toronto.
And undermanned Pacers just kept battling, kept coming. Nice job by Obie and his charges.
i’m not even going to discuss the last possession because there is no way this game should be close. there are nothing but losers on this team. i mean they barely squeaked out 3 wins this week against the dregs of the lead, and then they lose tonight to a team, without their 3 leading scorers, that is terrible even when those 3 guys are playing. there is no doubt in my mind they are coming back from this road trip 13-20 at BEST. i mean, boston, denver, utah, dallas, san antonio. there is NO WAY they beat any of those teams on the road. i honestly think they will lose to the clippers too, which would put them 12-21 after january 3rd.
A frustrating a disappointing loss. It’s weird to look at the stats because they make it look like we didn’t play as badly as we did. Watching the game, I thought for sure that we shot a worse % and had more turnovers than we actually did. I also thought that Indiana outrebounded us.
Last night I kept wondering how we lost that game. After looking at the stats, like 24-27 from the line for example, and I’m even more confused. For a team that seemed to do a lot of things right statistically, they sure blew the game.
About Thad. After your comments about him earlier last evening Dannie, I decided to watch how he attacked Foster. On our first made basket of the game, Thad hit a jumper from the corner. However, Foster was running out at him. Had Thad given him an upfake, he had a clear lane to the rim. A couple of possessions later, he did the same thing. So, even though Thad was 2-2, I didn’t think he took the “right” shots. It reminded me of that saying, “Not every shot you make is a good shot.” The thing is that later in the 1st Thad got the ball on the left side of the floor, free throw line extended, and he did give Foster an upfake and get to the rim, although he left the layup short. This of course reminded me of the other half of that saying, “Not every shot you miss is a bad shot”. Thad did it to Foster again in the 3rd quarter. He was on the right side of the floor around the top of the key. He gave Foster an upfake and got to the rim, this time making the layup.
I agree with you that Thad is settling for jumpers too much, but I think we need to give him credit when he does use a fake and get to the rim. He may not be doing it enough but hopefully he, or one of the coaches, recognizes this and we will see more of it.
Did not see the game, will watch it today. Dannie, I was hoping Deleo would use his situational guys better and Ivey is flat out his best man on man defender. Saw highlights and thought that Iggy played it to make Ford hit the jumper and in reality his strength is driving to the hoop. L.Will. seems to square up and get better shots when attacking a defender one on one than Iggy, and until Deleo realizes this we won!t win many at the end.
Blski, when your sitting in the corner most of the year because your the only “shooter” on the court it is probably easy to get caught up in being a jumpshooter. With Spieghts and J.Smith next year hopefully spreading the floor from the 5 spot we will see Thad develop that all round game but there just doesn!t seem to be that much space when Sam and Elton are out there this year.
I don’t want to rip Iggy because he really was put in unfair positions offensively and defensively. I know he makes MUCHO money! Ford is much quicker that him and he shouldn’t initiate offense at end of games. On the last possesionw ouldn’t the defense have more pressure on them if Speights was on the floor instead of Sammy? ALso, would have given Iggy another option to pass too.
Did anyone read Sammy’s quote in todays Inqy? DiLeo says” this is the Sam we need every night”. Sammy says” If that’s what they want, I have to play. I can’t be on the bench”.
Well, you have to earn that time. Time for a change of scenery. Maybe then he’ll get it.
Looking at team stats this morning [last nights game not included] . Turnover ranking by position. Sam [16 th] Elton [3rd] Thad [18th] Iggy [3rd] A.Miller [20 th]. Dannie , with Elton and Iggy as the biggest culprits I guess we can!t change this much. But, as always, the 3pt. and f.g. percentage looks again to be this team achiles heel.Dannie, if you start Rush and keep Donyel in your regular rotation [15 mpg. ?] I would think these would both improve along with our turnover ratio [more spot ups, less dribbling], if your coaching this team, with this personnel, don!t you try this, geez !!!
Dannie, 8-8 in these 16 games doesn’t look very good this morning. I’ll stay off Sammy for a while. Just frustrated with him. By the way ” HOW BOUT THOSE COWBOYS!” Eagles MUST take care of business today!
S.F.W., how about that Joe Flacco ?
Suede.…I hear you on Thad. I was responding to Dannie’s comments from yesterday and today (post #9). You bring up an interesting point, though. How much of Thad’s jumpshooting is due to the fact that the coaches want him taking jumpers because, as you said, he can actually make them and help spread the floor a bit for us. He still settles too much for me, but this could possibly explain some of it.
Blski, I just don!t think him and Iggy can work together unless we have spot up shooters at the 1 and 5. That is why I like him off the bench, he can do more “things” offensively. A puzzle where the pieces are pretty good but just don!t fit together right is how I would describe this team. If Rush could start at the 2 and catch and shoot for 20 minutes a night it would surely help E.S. to see if that is a piece we add next year [A.Parker ?]
Suede….I’m with you, again, with getting Rush and Marshall regular minutes, but starting Rush isn’t going to happen. During the game last night, Quinn Buckner mentioned that DiLeo is a big “Willie Green guy”. Not that I needed him to tell me, but it just reinforced for me that Willie will continue to start at the 2 for us. With Iguodala at the 3, there is no place for Rush in the starting 5.
Blski, A.Miller is playing real well and not turning the ball over, and until they get a spot up shooter in the mix I don!t see us making progress. Willie is doing well defensively and turnover wise but that is NOT what we need now and Ijust wish they would try something else.
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Suede…Thad off the bench is ok. So what does that give us? If we put Rush at the 2, our starting 5 is: Miller-Rush-Iguodala-Dalembert-and (with Thad coming off the bench) who at the 4, Speights?? Then we would have Green-Williams-Young-Marshall coming off the bench?? Is that kind of what you are thinking?
Blski, I!m thinking when we are fully healthy.Now starting Thad isn!t bad because Spieghts seems to produce off the bench and he and L.Will. seem to bring a spark although down the road who knows. A coach has to put players in positions where they succeed and right now Spieghts has shown a nervousness when starting. To me the Willie/Kareem switch is the one thing I would try along with Donyel getting some run.
hi what was the scor
Suede….We keep answering each other before the other guy answers back. Anyway, I would love to see us try something different because, as we are all too aware, what we are doing is not working. Problem is, I don’t see it happening.
DiLeo was an integral part of assembling this team. The guys we have drafted on his watch are “his guys”. As such, I think he has a tremendous amount of personal investment in some of these guys and that probably colors his perceptions and ideas as far as who can do what, who should be on the floor, and who is most capable of making us a winning basketball team.
I know this will probably sound either very stupid or very cynical, but I think that DiLeo is the coach not so much because he knows the guys on the team and what they can do, rather because he will be a more loyal company man. Here’s what I mean. Stefanski put this team together (with DiLeo’s help and input of course), so he has made his bed, so to speak. Stefanski also has a vision of how he wants this team to play. Well, a guy who is “just a coach” might not agree 100% with how Stefanski wants the team to play. “Just a coach” might also not hesitate to openly state that he doesn’t have enough talent on the roster, that he needs to add another player, or get rid of one he has. DiLeo, on the other hand, isn’t going to throw Stefanski under the bus. Since he had a hand in building the team, DiLeo will not readily admit that he, or Stefanski, did a bad job of it. As such, DiLeo will play “his guys” and stay true to “Stefanski’s vision” without complaint. Who knows? They may be right. Time will tell.
last season per game Sixers: A/20.4, TO/14.3, FG%/.460
this season (after 27 gms): A/19.7, TO/15.8, FG%/.440 - – clearly a decline in ball caretaking and shooting (considering last year’s team, strongly indicting numbers). Are being outshot by opponents in each basic category – FG, 3 Pt, FT.
1) Taking care of ball, 2) finding teammates, 3) shooting
4) consistently applied sound defense: fundamental areas of the game in which these Sixers – physically gifted (most) but mentally soft (many) - are proving to be deficient.
Those of you calling for Rush’s inclusion, how many of above needs does he meet if granted more minutes? How many deficiencies does he exacerbate? In my opinion, Rush is a bit player on a contending team; even on struggling Sixers, he hasn’t earned additional minutes with his play. Inserting him in prime minutes would be a change, but no cure.
Bski – Yeah I saw the two times he passed on the jumper and drove to the hole. He does do it sometimes and I really get excited when he does, not taking anything away from that. But what also needs to be noted is how many times he caught the ball, looked up saw Jeff Foster and didn’t even think about taking his slow ass too the cup. Until proven otherwise I just don’t see the “this guy can’t guard me and I am going to keep taking him until they stop me” mentality. All you have to do is look at his foul drawing and free throw attempts to see he simply is not aggressive enough especially considering his athletic ability. I just wish he would take it into his own hands screw the coaches not running plays for him (which again is complete bullshit).
The second part that pisses me off is the fact that the players nor coaches recognize it or if they do they completely ignore it. Going into that game and you looked at the matchups on the white board you saw this:
How would you rank those match ups based on perceived offensive advantage one-on-one? Isn’t that what coaches and good players do? Recognize a mismatch and attack it or at the very least, attempt to attack it to see if it is as soft as it looks on paper?
When Brand is not playing all I see if Miller and Iguodala pounding the ball on offense and when Lou is in the game add him simply POUNDING THE BALL.
The one thing I really like this year with Willie is he doesn’t pound the ball. He is either catching and shooting, catching and using productive dribbles north-to-south attacking the basket or he quickly moves the ball. Those other three guys have stickum on their hands and offense typically stalls. Miller is at least a strong passer with good court vision so I can live with him for now.
SFW – I need you to clarify this statement for me if you can:
I saw him asked to get ONE stop or make ONE offensive play. Two opportunities to win a game. Succeeding in either would have resulted in the victory. If it is unfair ask the second highest paid player and perceived star on THIS team, Andre Iguodala to do that than I might as well stop watching this team now – no joke.
The reality he came up LAME - again.
Dannie- “When Brand is not playing all I see if Miller and Iguodala pounding the ball on offense and when Lou is in the game add him simply POUNDING THE BALL.”
Agreed. Many possessions would see a dozen seconds tick off the clock with Iguodala and Miller piss-dribbling around the perimeter. Not enough crisp, purposeful ball movement.
I don’t really have an eye for this during the game, but what do they have Thad doing on offense? I would think they would have him running Jeff Foster all over through off-ball screens, Rip Hamilton style. Probably wasn’t the case, though. What would your ideal offense with these players involve?
Silver lining in all of this is that Dalembert increased his trade value – 11 points, 14 rebounds, 5 blocks. Can’t wait to turn on the computer to find he’s been traded – don’t much care who for at this point.
Boom – The best way to show you what they are currently doing is with an image. Maybe that is something I will do in the next two weeks. But the problem I have with playing Thaddeus at the power forward position is they don’t change the offense or their normal sets to adjust for him being there.
In the Sixers offense the bigs are almost exclusively screeners (bad ones at that). This season is a tad bit different with the addition of Brand they give him more low post opportunities and mid post isolations. But aside from that when you watch the Sixers on offense all you see is the 4 and 5 men setting pin down screens, baseline screens and ball screens. That in lies the problem with having Thad at the power forward position.
He is usually just setting screens for the three designated wing players, when he should be a wing player himself. I saw it a few times last night when Thad found himself roaming out to the perimeter where he is used to being as a small forward this season and Andre Miller waiving him to get in the PF spot in the offensive set which is the elbow. From that elbow position he has three options, go set a pin down, go to the baseline and set a baseline screen for two running guards or go set the ball screen.
Of all those situations I only like seeing him set the ball screen because he is a good pop option, roll option and if they switch that would have put Foster on Miller and Ford on Thad which actually happened a few times last night.
I think I saw him get one legit post up opportunity and sadly he short armed his lefty hook. Whenever he had the switch with a point guard on him the Pacers just doubled and kicked it out.
I’d rather see them do some more four out, with Thad setting a lot of ball screens, isos for Thad when matched up with a bigger slower defender and I would say some good ole fashion dribble at the wing player and go back door, but that isn’t there with this team because they can’t shoot and teams don’t overplay them on the perimeter.
Dannie, If I was to describe Iggy defensively it is he is better using his strength than lateral quickness or I would feel better having him guard a bigger player than a quicker one, in that respect I do agree with S.F.W. . At the end of a game to me L.Will. is flat out our best weapon offensively, again I agree with S.F.W., and both instances seem to be the coaches trying to instill in Iggy that he is the man with Elton not here and I for one would rather they play to win than defer to a players ego .
Jumpin, With Willie dribbling less, as Dannie stated, in reality playing Rush or Thad over Iggy at the 3 would get the result of more ball movement and less dribbling but we all know that is not happening. I!m not a Rush fan but as currently set up this team can!t become what we all wish because of bad screening and the urge of having to put the ball on the floor first.
Thanks Dannie, that was a good breakdown. I’ll be looking at that a bit closer next game.
Thad is limited by having no right hand. And his aversion to contact inside (likes to shoot on the go) keeps FT attempts low. Long and athletic, but back and shoulders aren’t built for the heavy lifting of a 4.
suede I like Thad over Iggy at 3 but whataya do with your big dollar investment? He’s wanting as a 2. And you’re contractually stuck with him and his crybaby act for awhile. Looking forward to the ‘no Dalembert, Miller and Iguodala’ regime. Might be awhile. “Less pounding” should be pounded into team’s head as Dannie strongly suggested.
JJG – Agreed
Suede – Excuses, excuses, excuses. Tired of ‘em in defense of this dude.
Why again is Iguodala a vital and expensive part of this team if asking him (a supposed strong defender) to get a stop ONCE vs. a player 6 inches shorter, with a sore hamstring coming off a 38 minutes game and in the 34th minute of that game is unfair? If you know T.J. Ford is the guy they want taking the shot you step up and say I want that challenge and you win that battle – period. Ford saw Iguodala and in him mind by waiving away screens said this guy can’t guard me, watch. And he sadly he was right.
So all game we go to Iguodala offensively, run countless plays for him, iso him, he scored 26 etc and at the end of the game its unfair to ask him to make a shot on his own?
Sorry guys getting a little tired of hearing what Iguodala CAN’T do when I keep watching this team lose ball games.
Personally, besides the fact that I don’t trust Iguodala to do anything right late in games or trust Louis Williams defense at all, I put Miller on Ford because at least I know he has the focus, mental toughness and grit to overcome the lack of foot speed or lateral quickness as he showed against Jarret Jack the previous defensive possession.
Nothing more than another over valuation of Andre Iguodala on both ends by the coach/guy that scouted, evaluated and probably recommended drafting him.
Not in a good Sixers mood right now.
entry 28 was not me. no biggie.
Dannie, we just agree to disagree. I’m trying not to bring his salary into this. On a championship challenging team Iggy is the third or fouth offensive option and the third best player. I’m taking most of my frustration out on Sammy right now. I think Speights should’ve been on the court for that last offensive posession but DiLeo was trying to reward Sammy for his effort during the game. Tired of that. Agree with you. I’m also not in a good Sixers mood right now but hey merry christmas. Time to wrap some presents………………….
I’m looking forward to the game when Thad is given the ball on the wing and does his best Billy C impersonation! I think that day will come.
I just watched the first 1/2 and I thought the passing was very good and there was less dribbling and Sammy was moving better on offense but defensively they just didn!t work hard enough. I!m afraid to watch the 2nd 1/2.
SFW – We can agree to disagree but, didn’t Stefanski say we are in a PAY for performance business after firing Mo? How can we not bring his salary into the discussion if that is really the case. He also said their grades are in the paper the next day. Well I saw 5 turnovers, a missed shot (poor shot selection to boot) to win the game and the inability to get a stop to win the game. 26, 6, 6, 2 in a losing effort. What grade do you give that?
Dannie…I completely understand where you’re coming from with Thad, and I agree. Post #35 is the perfect explanation for the problems you brought up in post #31.
I see it as a combination of things. The coaches don’t recognize and adjust or call plays to take advantage of him, as you said. Also, Thad is still very young. I think he does exactly what the coaches tell him, which means he is too tied to the play to break from it, even when he has an advantage. I’m sure he also knows that this is not “his” team so he has a tendency to defer and, in the process, pass up some opportunities. As he learns and matures, I’m hoping he will develop the recognition and the confidence to take advantage of every mismatch he has, regardless of the coaches or the play call.
One more thing. I meant to add Thad’s aversion to contact, as stated by jjg in #39, as another factor in my previous explanation.
Blski, agree with your Thad logic; just finished watching the game and am surprised L.Will.!s foul on the 3 wasn!t brought up, a very stupid play. Ford made a difficult shot,and Iwill give him credit on their last possession and Dannie I definitely would of had Lou or A.Miller on him in that situation. Iggy!s reckless scoring skillset just doesn!t bode well in end game situations with offensive fouls and turnovers a likely result when the opponents defense is geared to stop him so no, I won!t blame him for that. He is what he is and hopefully, somehow, either Lou,Thad or a future teammate can put him in the proper role as the 3rd banana, so to speak.
In defense of Iggy’s personality…
Yes, he’s a strange one. Yes, his frustrations on the court come across as crybaby-ish. But given this team and situation, how else would you like him to be?
First off, he doesn’t complain about every little thing, and when he does complain he always has a pretty good case for it. Also, Iggy’s b*itching doesn’t even come close to Reggie’s, but I guess Reggie’s able to do it in a much more charming and quirky way so it comes across more as “Reggie being Reggie”. When Iggy does it, it looks annoying, but him and Reggie are doing the exact same thing. Maybe Iggy needs acting lessons?
Secondly, of all the players on the Sixers, no one gets more visibly frustrated after a loss than Iguodala. I repeat, he’s an unusual personality, not in a he’s-a-character way like Brett Myers, but just different, kind of like McNabb. He did radio sessions once a week with Howard Eskin last year during their run, and suprisingly he let his guard down a little with Eskin, and what I heard was someone who was, to emphasize the theme of my comments – a little odd. But you can be a non-charming atypical personality and still really want to win, really care, and really want to succeed.
Last year, when the Sixers were losing at the beginning of the season, does anyone remember how he voiced his frustrations in the media, how he would go to the bench if that’s what the team needed, how they need to try something different? I think everything we’ve seen from Iggy personality-wise is consistent with how he reacted to those early team struggles, and that is: HE REACTS WHEN THE TEAM IS NOT SUCCEEDING BECAUSE HE CARES. I can’t argue with questioning his talent. It’s possible he worked on his skills all summer and just couldn’t get better. But I’m perfectly fine with his personality.
Dannie, not up to debate further. Between Sixers & Eagles a bit down. Fortunately I live in a rancher. Jumping would only injure not kill. The focus will really be on the Sixers after the Eagles are eliminated next week. Hopefully, they take Dallas out, also.
Zack: introspective take. one thing i always noticed is he always took it personal when they lost. like it was is fault that he couldnt hit the go-shot like a Kobe/Iverson duty. he really believes its his responsibility. notice when he takes Speights, Lou or Sam to the side to talk it over when there is some miscommunication that results in turnover. seems he has the mentality of a leader. just not the ability though, which is a shame. i still think there is a place for him on this team, some coach just needs to pick his spots for him, cos Iggy-bless his heart-will try to take everything upon himself and will come up Lame, like Dannie says. trading him for the mediocre talent you get in return might turn out to be a BIG mistake – not that it is likely, but he WILL do a lot better somewhere else than here, i hate to see that happen. he is what he is. its a closed book anyway.
everyone seems to be watching the sixers in anticipation of improvement. au contraire, i’m just waiting to see a change; i think thats when we can actually begin to talk. don’t forget that this is the SAME team, whaddyu think dramatic results now? the coach is just the beginning, well at least now we are forced to see more of Speights and Williams which is a good thing.
Dannie- your analysis is pretty deep, whaddyu think: do we just need to shift players in their roles, move some, blend and gel or is it something more ?
sorry to do this; its a sixer blog but -
Eagles ‘control their destiny’, Dallas lost, beat a sputtering washington redskins team and you have a showdown set up IN PHILLY against the hated COWBOYS on the LAST DAY of the season setting up the ultimate delight of being able to end Dallas’ season and make the playoffs IN FRONT OF YOUR HOMETOWN FANS and salvage a rocky season.
<choke> <choke> <sputter> 3 points!
wow eagles fans must be really loyal to keep watching after this.
Zack - I got no qualms with Iguodala personality. For one I don’t know the guy. He could be a good dude for all I know. I typically keep it strictly to the basketball court and what is said about what happened on the basketball court.
His on court mannerisms are annoying because his talent isn’t great enough to make fans overlook it. Kobe acts the same a lot of the time crying to the refs, AI did it too among other great players. Their talent was so great we overlook it. I personally don’t care about athlete’s personality as much as others I just want them to play their heart out, act like they know playing professional basketball or any sport is a privilege, have no off court incidents and win some damn games.
J.Kay, Ithought Iggy actually attempted to dribble less and spot up shoot more in this game. Offensively I liked what I saw for the most part. Eventually I would like to see Iggy back at the 2 and see if it can work for good, he is shooting better and we need to know how to move on from here for next year.
suede: i don’t mind the ball in Iggy’s hand; his assists, though risky with the turnovers, are necessary for a team with very little shooting ability. i just don’t get why they still run plays FOR him why his strengths are clearly when the play is run THROUGH him. it’s obvious he’s playing better, he will be always under scrutiny. this is one of the bold changes i would like to see, how many new tricks can this old system pick up?
this 2,3 talk has my head spinning, half the time you can’t even tell where he is at, he still plays the same. as per guarding, they switch him and thad so many times on the wing/forwards depending on success and fouls that really you should just stick with no designation as per position.
yeah tell me bout moving onto next year, I am as clueless as the coaches!
Frustrating game, ugh.
Who should have guarded Ford: I’m ok with the decision to put Iguodala on Ford…I think the athleticism + height combination works well on smaller, quicker players to force them into a lower % shot. Let’s remember that TJ Ford is probably among the top 10 quickest players in the NBA…he can shake almost anyone in the league long enough to get a split second opportunity for a jumpshot. I think this was Ford making a good move rather than Iguadala letting us down.
That said, if I’m coach, Royal Ivey is the guy I put on Ford in a heartbeat. Ivey’s defense, UNLIKE A-Miller or Iguodala’s is actually the closest thing to “lock down” we probably have. He’s also the type of guy that is mentally tough, and can handle the pressure of being thrown in the game for one play. Much better matchup here, especially given that he’s 6′3.
Dannie: Totally agree with your post about Andre Miller. I think in the past four games, even though his shooting hasn’t been overwhelming in some of them, he has started to play with a hell of a lot of swagger…the type of swagger and attitude I expect from my starting PG that makes $9 million a year.
Kareem Rush: I agree with many on here that he should be getting some more minutes…but I think people are really overrating this guy’s game a bit. Yes, he can hit a 3 point shot. After that, he’s a pretty good slasher when he wants to be…but unlike, say, Kyle Korver, who at least took shots really nicely in the flow of the offense and played a team game…K-Rush is pretty much a jack-it-up type of guy, and has never proved himself to be an adept passer, or reliable in other areas of the game. He also does not have the composure, or cool under pressure/assasin gene as a guy like Eddie House, that gets off on quieting an opposing crowd.
K-Rush shouldn’t be getting 5 minutes…but more than 15 is out of the question. As is starting him.
Attitude…fire…mojo…swagger…cajones…whatever term you want to use, our team lacks it. BIG time. I have never understood how a professional athlete is capable of having a laizze fair attitude about things. These guys are getting paid zillions of dollers, and have their own reputations and images to project. I want ONE GUY that will actually grow a godamn nutsack and just go down swinging.
And to whichever poster said “Iguodala is hurt over losses because he cares…” you know what? @!#$ that. It’s all well and good that he “feels bad” after games…and that he can pull a nice “woe is me” and “woe is our team” line. Who gives a @!#$. I could care less if our whole team cries like babies after each loss. I want a LEADER. If Iguodala cares about losing so much, than how about he plays like a @!@#ing assasin, takes it on himself to will his team to wins and rally the troops around him, instead of driving into mother@!#$ing traffic for the $#!@ing 80th play in a row, only to panic and throw away another @!#$ing !@#$tty pass to the other @!#$ing team!
(whew…that’s vented at Iguodala, not you poster! And Iguodala, if you read the above…I curse because I “care”)
Dannie…given the fact that this team has not played with any fire for more then two quarters at a time this whole season…has no dominant personality on the team, pussyfoots around on the perimeter like little babies and whine to refs, dont play like a team, etc…why do you not want the long term coach to be hired in mid January? I really think we need to inject this team with some life…and I’d rather take the second half of the year learning a long term coach’s offensive sets and play with passion and have a half year with the guy under our belt for the 09-10 season than start in the fall from scratch.
Dannie, before I head to work I wanted to throw something out there; is it more the type of low post player or just any low post player that is hard for these guys to adjust to, because it seems the offense is more fluid with a guy that isn!t demanding a doubleteam than with a guy that does. Dave T. mentioned the type of offense in Florida where Marreese had to move a lot and cut rather than the more stationary game Elton tends to play. What I!m asking is can Elton ,by watching film, be more of a slashing type guy and would that help the team or should they let him play his game and revolve the offense around him. Time to get out in the cold, have a good day guys.
Dave T….I really think that Stefanski wants to stay with DiLeo as coach so he can get an accurate read on what they’ve got right now. I touched on some of this in post #29, but let me explain a bit more.
I think Stefanski wants to know exactly what he has before he starts making any moves (players or coaches). Stefanski obviously believes that the roster he has assembled should be playing better basketball (Come to think of it, maybe having the players and coaches watch the entire “Better Basketball” series of DVD’s might help). Stefanski needs to see “his style of play” executed the way he envisions it with the players we have in order to figure out what is lacking. Is it the system that is faulty? Is it that the players we have can’t grasp the system? Is it that the players grasp it but we just don’t have enough talent to be successful running it?
Anyway, in order to accomplish this, Stefanski needs a coach that will play “his style” and “his guys” 100% and without question. DiLeo understands this and, most likely, is in complete agreement with Stefanski. Also, unlike a new hire, DiLeo does not require any breaking in period to get acclimated and get a handle on each player and what he can and cannot do. I think this is a significant factor because whatever length of time a new hire would need could put this season in jeopardy. Since Stefanski believes in the team he has assembled, I’m sure he thinks that going with DiLeo gives them a chance to make something of this season, as I’m certain he wants to win now.
The best case for us, IMO, is that DiLeo does what Stefanski needs him to do so that Stefanski is able to accurately assess the situation before the trade deadline. I am hopeful that once Stefanski gets a read on whether it is the sytem or the players (and which ones), he will know what we need going forward. Then he can start making deals, moving players that don’t fit, and deciding on a head coach hire, all with an eye toward putting us on solid footing for next year and beyond.
Dave T – I am going to write something up that addresses that a bit today. It’s more about a wait and see approach then completely committing to doing that.
I got a kick out of this from the Ball Don’t Lie power rankings:
19. Philadelphia 76ers—Yo, Sixuhs. You only have Toronto to beat in terms of the “massively disappointing, only have to look slightly better under the interim coach, while working with huge gobs of excuses” strata. Congrats, so far. [KD]
I recommend checking their site out regularly if any of you don’t already. They did a few interviews with Kenny Smith, Ernie Johnson, and Charles Barkley recently that are worth reading. My Christmas gift to the Recliner GM commenters.
Simply put, Iggy has to convert his layups and not fold in the 4th after three great quarters the last couple of games.
This season, there has been plenty of contact and no-calls, so the Sixers MUST get used to it!! There’s no crying in Basketball! We were whining too much last Saturday and it cost us big time!
Against Boston, we have to be TOUGH mentally and physically and play our “A” game, absolutely no recklessness and no whining!! There could be a 25% chance of complacency for the Celtics because they could be looking ahead to their Christmas game against the Lakers, so if complacency is there, take advantage of it!!!
Sixers have NO CHANCE tomorrow night. A perfect schedule coincidence (vs. historic arch-rival Philadelphia) and resurgent Celtic pride (not to menton superior talent) will carry Boston to record-setting 27-2 start, besting ‘67 Seventy-Sixers and ‘69 Knickerbockers (both 26-2 and eventual Champs). Arnold “Red” Auerbach will be lighting up from the Great Beyond. Even if the 76ers rise in defiance on their memory of earlier massacre, history-making will prevail … an inevitability. Only question, final score.
For accuracy’s sake, rocketing teams were specifically the ‘66-’67 Sixers and ‘69-’70 Knicks (3 seasons apart).
Hey guys, has anyone here seen this?
http://flickr.com/photos/23744547@N02/3114942913/
I wonder where our individual sixers would land?
Does anyone want anything from the Warriors except Monta Ellis and Biedrins (untouchables)? According to what I’ve been hearing and reading, the team is a complete mess! Don Nelson seems to have tuned out this season, and according to TrueHoop he just got into a little “tiff” with Stephen Jackson. Does anyone want him? Only 30 years old, reasonable salary of ~$8.5M a year. They don’t play any defense, the fans expect them to get blown out of every game and the city is losing interest. They’ve already turned on Jamal Crawford, who they just got, and they’re constantly pining for players from their recent heyday: Matt Barnes, J-Rich, Baron, Al Harrington. These fans believe that when a player leaves the Warriors, he truly becomes a better player. Nelson strings the rookies along, being completely inconsistent with their playing time and their rewards/punishment, but he’ll let Stephen Jackson and the older guys shoot an unconscionable FG% without, seemingly, any repurcussions. But supposedly, they’ve given up on the season and wanna play the young guys more… There’s a lot of unhappiness, confusion, and incompetence out here that the Sixers could potentially take advantage of.
Seriously, they were considering trading Brandan Wright or Anthony Randolph for Raymond Felton. Playing around with the trade machine, Lou Williams + Reggie Evans for Marcus Williams (or Anthony Morrow or C.J. Watson) + Stephen Jackson? But that seems like too much given the Warriors’ current vulnerable state.
Raro - I read that yesterday. Here is the post link that explains everything. They already have Reggie Evans in the “brute rebounder” category.
Zack – Where does Stephen Jackson fit when we already have Iguodala and Thaddeus? If we got him I would assume Thad automatically goes to the bench.
I’d take Anthony Morrow though.
Bski: Got a good chuckle about that Better Basketball DVD sit down haha. Great sum up in your first two paragraphs in your above post. Don’t disagree with anything you said…I just think it’ll take a good 20-25 games to get our team on the same page under whatever new long term coach we hire come fall…I’d rather have this time right now to work out the kinks rather than at the start of another season.
I figure if our team is a mess right now…that’s the BEST time to put a whole new offense in. Plus, as far as “saving the season/win now” approach, our new long term replacement would do just as good a job as DiLeo would. And also, I’m not saying get a new coach right now…I think mid-late January would be ideal…that way ES gets time to see what the hell we’ve got here under DiLeo, make some decisions of the direction he wants to go in, and get Avery or EJ’s butt in here (Van Gundy is the only other legit option IMO, and I don’t think he’s ideal).
Zack: When looking around the league, I too have noticed the Warriors “mess” situation, and hodge podge of talent. And I think thinking about acquiring a guy like Stephen Jackson, or Jamal Crawford, is definitely in the realm of something we’re looking for. But as Dannie said, if that were to happen we’d either need to move Thad to the bench (something I do NOT want to happen for the long term sanity of this team)…or for Iguodala to be the trade piece.
Iguodala ($12-13 mill) for Crawford ($9-10 million off the top of my head) or Captin Jax ($9 mill) and one other more minor G-State Warrior player. I just can’t see it happening though with the make up of their team…and, well, if you’re G-State, would you trade one A-/B+ player AND a talented role player for our one inconsistent B to sometimes B+ guy? I wouldn’t.
With Biedrins is implanted at C, they are probably looking to have either Brandon Wright or A Randolph be their future PF, or maybe lining up a 7 foot monster of Randolph/Wright/Biedrins for their 3/4/5. And while they do have a plethora of shoot first combo guards (Ellis, Crawford, Jackson, Morrow, Bellinelli)…any trade for Iguodala would mean they’d also have to get Maggette outta there, who many “insiders” seem to think they regret signing.
I think more likely the Warriors will ship out Maggette soon for expiring deals or role players, just to open up some PT for all their swingmen.
Boom: “Ball Don’t Lie” is definitely one of the most entertaining NBA reads on the internet haha…love those guys. Great find with their assessment of the Sixers…and thank god for the Raptors, who we can always point to and say, “At least we’re not Toronto right now.”
Yahoo! Sports has really stepped up their sports section the last two years to be on par with the big boys…their stuff is great.
I think since they got that Knicks gunner(crawford) they’ve been horrible. He’s always played his own game on the court. Puts up numbers but not a team player at all.
Trade proposals to break the monotony of this season: 1) Miller & Dalembert to Memphis for Lowry & the ghost of “Big Country” Reeves
2) AI2 to Detroit for AI 3) Reggie Evans to Indiana for the rights to Reggie Miller, to be lured from retirement with a promise to play at MSG in front of Spike Lee again 4) Ratliff to Houston for Mutumbo
5) Bob Salmi to Oklahoma City for future considerations.
Dannie, I just think Thad is too inexperienced to be playing SF right now, and needs time to work on his weaknesses (that have been discussed at length already). Like I said before, my most recent “theory” is that Iggy CAN play shooting guard, but when he does it leaves a gaping hole at the vital SF position. Jackson can fill that void until Thad is ready. Rookies need time, as evidenced by what’s going on with OKC. You can also look at Iguodala, and Lou.
And if Thad is THE FUTURE, having a true small forward around who could mentor him a little and set an example wouldn’t be the worst idea, instead of a tweener like Iggy. People have said that having Brand around would be good for Speights’ development, so why not have someone for Thad? Jackson’s contract is kind of long, and although durable I don’t think he’s ever played a whole 82 games in his career; but he seems to heal in time for the playoffs.
Exploring the trade a little more… Yes, that moves Thad (and Willie) to the bench, but I could see him with a new role – Lou’s replacement as the fresh-off-the-bench scorer. Currently, Lou gets to take a lot of shots off the bench – and if you remove him, that leaves more shots for Thad, Speights, Willie, Rush, etc., and they’d get those shots because you have a more traditional PG-type in Royal Ivey.
JJG: Regarding Bob Salmi…I say don’t even bother with future considerations. Let’s just dump him for nothing in return like Denver did with Marcus Camby, just to save some cap space (in our case, we’d be dumping Salmi for our collective sanity).
And I definitely don’t want Steve Mix back in the booth, as he wasn’t exactly steller either. I think it’s high time Tom McGuiness from WIP Sixers radio be given a shot at television work.
Zack: I see your logic in the S-Jax move…agree with some, not all of it…but I don’t think trading youth for age makes a whole lot of sense. He’s already turning 33 soon, I believe? And, again, I don’t see why G-State even considers making this move, unless they’ve already shipped Maggette out and have a glaring hole at SF for themselves.
jjg
This is a response to something you said a long time ago up top. The reason I said left handed “floater”, is because thats what it said in the post by Dannie:
“4. Misses a left hand floater in traffic (Are you telling me that is the best shot you got to win a game? A damn fading floater with your weak hand?)”
I agree that your definition of floater was right, but I made my comment before I saw the shot on video.
haha i just spit coffee out onto my keyboard after reading the proposed ratliff for mutombo v.2.0 trade.
oh and royal ivey is most definitely not a traditional PG
Zack, if they really want to dump Maggette maybe we can convince Nelson that Sammy can play next to Biedrens for 10 to 15 minutes a night and give Sam to them for Maggette and Turiaf. A A.Miller/Maggette/Iggy/Elton/ [Spieghts,Turiaf,Theo] lineup would be an upgrade in talent and though he isn!t a deep shooter he gets to the line and is a legit scorer.
lol we already have 2 starters from an awful clippers team. now you’re talking about 3? ask KG what he thinks about cory maggette.
suede, the Sixers should try anything that would be in their favor in any way with the Warriors. They’re getting their ass kicked again, BTW.
BTW, is there anyone you’re watching in the pac-10 this year? I got Cal and Stanford nearby; I’m thinking I might be a year late.
has anyone mentioned sergio rodriguez here? i don’t know much about his game other than what i’ve read. he can’t get any burn in portland because his fast-break style is at odds with nate mcmillan’s half-court structure. a deal for andre miller before the deadline seems like it would make sense.
Suede: Maggette is a bum, and probably the single worst player anyone could possibly think of bringing to the Sixers. Just what we need…an athlete with zero bball IQ, that is a ball hog, that is a mediocre shooter at best, whose only game revolves around driving with reckloss abandon to the basket. AND is over paid by $1-2 million a year.
Dalembert is perfectly fine when he gets minutes. I really disagree with the Dalembert hating on here…if he gets the 29-33 mpg that he wants, his strengths have always outweighed the negatives. He might mope, he might whine, and he might think he simply “deserves” his minutes, instead of earning them. But when push comes to shove…he’s 6′11, he’s athletic, he alters a hell of a lot of shots (a stat that doesn’t show up on the box score) and he can be a very good rebounder when he wants to.
Besides…if you trade Dalembert for a big man…you’re not going to get an upgrade, it’s going to be a sideways deal. And if you trade Sammy for a more classic SG (that can, uh, shoot), that then means we have a logjam with Iguodala, Thad, the newcomer, and Lou.
The only way I’d consider trading Dalembert is for the following combo:
-We get a borderline all star, or very good scorer, at the SG position that can shoot the hell out the rock in return.
-We also get a gritty, veteran 6′10 or above guy in the same deal, to replace D-Bere in the middle.
-We slide Iguodala to SF, the newcomer SG to SG, and have Thad coming off the bench, forming a 1-2 punch with Lou to be one of the best bench tandems in the league.
DaveT., I am not a Sammy hater, if he is a 20 min.,5 mill. per, Turiaf kinda guy than he may help you win but as a 30 minute player he has never been part of a winner and in a 7 game playoff series he is a guy who!s warts tend to show greatly.You rate him higher than I defensively, too many times this year he has been 5 ft. or closer to a player and not even challenged them. Theo, at his old age is still better defensively, but only in spurts. There is a reason he can!t get back into games once he is taken out, its because his teammates play better without him.
Zack, Harden is probably the best 2 guard in the country and I watch U.C.L.A. to catch Collison but its not the same after all that talent left last year.
Zack: There’s one guy in the Pac-10 (not named Harden, who is definitely without question the best SG in the country) that I want to just put in a canon and launch straight into Philadelphia, and that is Chase Budinger. One of the prettiest strokes in the country, breathes bball IQ, and has steadily become more consistent over the years. Love watching him play…if he ever learned to play defense and get a little tougher, he’d be off the hook. He’s like the all around game of Anthony Parker + the shooting of Kyle Korver. At 6′7, definitely a guy that can be in a regular NBA rotation off the bench and contribute nicely.
Mike: Sergio’s name has been thrown around here a few times as something to look at. I’m not sure what to think of him…I see him as a Jason Williams type minus the flash: hell of a lot of talent, can make some jaw droppingly good passes and rack up 8 assists in 10 minutes of play sometimes; other times, he plays wrecklessly, out of control, and is a TO machine. I have a hard time projecting his ceiling, and have a feeling most others do as well, including Portland. I’m 50/50 whether he’s a hidden gem talent that with the right coach could blossom into a starter…or a streaky guy that’ll never make the cut.
Bski and I have also mentioned the possibility of looking into the availability of Ramon Sessions, another young PG caught in a weird PG situation with the Bucks. I’m pretty in love with him as far as a future PG for us to groom.
DaveT., He could be there when we pick, but not sure he can be a 2 guard[no handle] and very inconsistant shooter so far. Korver is a good comparison, better athlete but not as good a passer and would be a good fit off the bench but Harden is a top 5 pick so we probably have no shot at him anyway.I thought Harden was a slasher but he is hitting the 3 this year. Do you think Curry can be an N.B.A. p.g.?
Suede: Can’t agree with you about “not as good a passer”. I think Chase Budinger has a wonderful eye for the court…he can really read how a play unfolds…spot a cutter, make a crisp pass. He sees the court much more like a PG or a Point-Forward. To me, Korver showed absolutely no versatility with his game. Every year he said he worked all offseason to improve his handle and driving abilities…I never saw the improvement on court in his play, and he certainly never made those around him better. Take away Korver’s shooting, at the NBA level he had squadoosh.
Chase I see as the opposite…moves without the ball EXCELLENTLY, quick release, can hit the midrange J and 3, isn’t quick but has all kinds of savvy tricks up his sleeve to catch defenders off balance and caught off guard. If his shooting his off, his rebound and assist numbers are usually way up, and he’s such a deep ball threat he usually opens up the floor for others.
The only reason I mention Budinger is because I think he’d be right there in the 14-20 pick range in the 1st round, where we’ll most likely be picking.
gotcha, thanks for the response Dave.
ok i have summarized the offense struggles down to one major factor; Brand came from LA; they play a certain style, Philly plays a different style. Brand is the star so the team has to adjust their game to suit him. Sixers trying to do something they havent done before = struggles. well thats not all of it but i’d say bout 70%. i wonder whether it can ever work. if it can’t might as well move players to make sure it does.
ok unwritten rule here if you wanna trade iguodala, FINE! just get equal or better in return. either some top tier role player type (turkoglu?) or some lottery pick that somehow turns into a borderline star. in ball, the sum of the parts theory don’t work so you need a great starting five as opposed to good 1-9. ok its obvious iguodala doesnt really fit, but heck its not like we have a lot of talent!!
Dave T: seriously Sammy is not what you think he is, or rather what you wish he is. This happens everytime someone looks at the stats. just like comparing Iguodala to paul pierce and kobe bryant (their stats are VERY SIMILAR!) what you think he could easily be for us, he isnt and may never be. Trading him would just be making a less risky decision based on the odds of him turning it around.
suede: after watching this season so far, why are you still contemplating late round picks; we just need to draft ONE player with legit ability. for legit shooting ability, they dont fall past the lottery. think OJ Mayo (star) NOT Mario Chalmers (who will peak soon). i know its unreasonable….YET! cmon trade machine!
Dave T., Budinger!s numbers are better this year and he seems to be showing more consistancy shooting, but over the last couple of seasons ,surrounded by talent, I never saw him put 2 good 1/2 !s together and I will watch him more.A good fit here ? Anybody that dribbles less and can shoot would be a good fit here but I!m leery of trying the turn a 3 into a 2 experiment again. As far as Maggette, the way our cap situation is any upgrade in talent may have to have some risk involved [a player that needs a 2nd chance, doesn!t fit somewhere, etc.] He seems to have shot better the last couple years and gets to the line as good as anybody and coming from Duke I figured his I.Q. couldn!t be that bad. Is he a bit selfish, maybe, but this team needs somebody that pushes Iggy down a notch ,in my opinion, to the place he belongs.My gut feeling on Sammy, you need big talent around him to win and you can!t put big talent around him because of what he makes. JayK., Minn. has 4 number #1 picks, although on the surface this isn!t a great draft class. We really got lucky getting two guys that can contribute right away in the last 2 years and I hope E.S. reputation as a talent evaluator is as good as we heard because we need help.
JayK., by the way , if I was offered Augustine or Chalmers today for Spieghts I would probably do it. Getting the proper pieces to the puzzle is key and to get you have to give.
JayK., finally, a shooter can be had after the 15 th pick, look at C.Lee for Orlando, he would be perfect here.
Dave T….I’ve caught up with everything posted since last night.
I don’t necessarily disagree with your thoughts on hiring our new coach in mid-January and using the rest of the season getting everyone and everything together. It’s just that I’m thinking ES will be patient and very cautious.
We all know the story: Cheeks was already here when ES
was hired…..ES didn’t want to tear everything apart immediately…..and it went from there. When Cheeks was fired, almost every story I read excused it, at least partially, by saying that Cheeks wasn’t Stefanski’s guy and that it was surprising that Stefanski stayed with Cheeks as long as he did. Anyway, our next coach will be Stefanski’s hire. Whoever he brings in will be “his guy” and I think he is going to make sure he brings in exactly who he wants. I don’t know that Avery J., Eddie J., or Jeff VG is that guy for him.
Stefanski had better choose wisely because, for me at least, his feet are getting closer to the fire with every step he takes. Here is what I mean. The team is not playing well. Up to now, people weren’t looking at the team ES assembled as closely, or at least weren’t as totally focused on it, as they might have been because they had Cheeks to blame (not that he didn’t deserve blame). After all, Cheeks wasn’t Stefanski’s hire, right? Well, now Cheeks is no longer here, so we can no longer blame him (Stefanski inches a bit closer to the fire).
Now we have DiLeo. If he is no more successful than Cheeks, or marginally so, Stefanski still has a bit of a cushion. Stefanski had to make a decision because Cheeks wasn’t getting the job done, right? Also, DiLeo really is a front office guy who hasn’t been on the bench in quite a while, isn’t he? ES has some built in, partial excuses here in his defense, if you’d like to give them to him.
The thing I’m getting at is that once ES makes his decision on a head coach there is no more cushion for him. The subpar, inherited Cheeks will be gone as will the emergency front office fill in. The new coach will be his decision and his guy all the way. There will be nowhere for him to hide. Also, if “his” head coach doesn’t succeed then we must begin to seriously question the team he has put together and whether any head coach can win with it.
About Ramon Sessions….I’m thinking maybe we should start a website. Something like bringramonsessionstophilly.com so that we both have a place to deal with the man-crush we have on him. (I’m Joking…but seriously, he would be a good pickup for us.)
Bski: Like your response about the coaching thing, and all your points about ES’ mindset, especially the “built in excuses” factor, are right on. And I’m getting now you were explaining things more from ES point of view, not your own, so the following is for ES, not you buddy! With a late January hire, maybe even early February, that gives ES a whole two months to get a feel for all his players, what he really has, and to melt his eyes away from so much coaching game tape.
I really think there’s also a psychological thing from the players standpoint of playing for an interum guy that they know probably won’t be around. It’s like there is this feeling of, “Well, alright, let’s get this season over with and to next season when our long term guy is here…this is just a stop gap.” Im not saying players don’t try or anything…but with a new interum coach midseason you’re basically implimenting a quasi-new system anyway and totally changing the mindset.
Better IMO to have this be as little time as possible, so that by the time the long term coach gets there, the players haven’t gotten that used to the interum’s system that it feels like they are learning a 3rd system in one year (see: 03-04 to 05-06 Sixers…Ayers, Ford, Obie, Cheeks).
Bski…”BringRamonSessionsToPhilly.com” it is! Somehow I don’t think it will generate the type of excitement as “HeyLarryHughesStopTakingSoManyBadShots.com” though.
JKay: Saying you cannot get a rotation player, or a star, past the lottery is just flat out not true. And plenty of them can shoot the hell out of the rock. The 00’s is THE era where you can find gems in the rough in the later first, and often early 2nd round. I think now, since the college game is so damn watered down, that the % of a team being able to (with good scouting) land a legit player from picks 15-40 is very high:
2000: Michael Redd (43), Hedo Turkoglu (16), Quentin Richardson (18), Eduardo Najea (38), Eddie House (37).
2001: Gilbert Arenas (31), Tony Parker (28), Zach Randolph (19), Gerald Wallace (25), Mehmet Okur (38).
2002: Carlos Boozer (34), John Salmons (26), Roger Mason Jr. (30), Flip Murray (41), Matt Barnes (45), Darius Songaila (49), Rasual Butler (51).
2003: David West (18), Josh Howard (29), Leandro Barbosa (28), Travis Outlaw (23), Kendrick Perkins (27), Jason Kapono (31), Steve Blake (38), Willie Green (41).
2004: Josh Smith (17), Jameer Nelson (20), Beno Udrih (29), Delonte West (24), JR Smith (18), Tony Allen (25), Anderson Varajao (30), Chris Duhon (38), Trevor Ariza (43).
2005: Danny Granger (17), Monte Ellis (40), David Lee (30), Nate Robinson (21), Jason Maxiel (26), Lou Williams (45), Hakim Warrick (19), Jarret Jack (22), Luther Head (23), Linus Kleiza (27), , Brandon Bass (33), Rony Turiaf (37), Andray Blatche (49), Ryan Gomes (50).
And the list goes on.
Suede, thanks for clarifying my feelings also regarding Sammy.
If I’m the sixers I’m targeting some players if they continue to flounder and Lou Will doesn’t earn a starter minutes. Sammy, Lou Will & Reggie(who I love) would be the primary trade bait
On Sac, Garcia & Brad Miller
on Denver, Klieza & JR Smith
on Chicago, Hinrich or Gordon
on GS, Azubuike & Bellinelli
on Lakers, JFarmar
On Minny, RMcCants
On Portland Rodriguez & Webster
Dave T….I’m glad you got where I’m coming from. Sorry for any confusion. I had the same problem with Zack a few months ago. Most of the time my comments are about the way things are (or at least how they appear to me). When I say something it’s usually from the standpoint of what I feel is the most likely to happen based on the past patterns of a coach, player, or whatever. I try to see things like they do and get into their heads a bit in an effort to better understand what is going on, why it is happening, and where things might be going. It’s just how I approach things. However, that doesn’t mean that I agree with what is going on and the way things are. I will try to be more clear in my posts so that everyone knows whether I am speaking about the way things are or I am stating my own opinion on the way I would like things to be.
As far as your posts….All valid points you made about bringing in our new head coach sooner. I understand your point of view. Good idea to avoid another Ayers-Ford-Obie-Cheeks stretch. I love this discussion, btw. Great job on your end of it.
I could go your route, with a few caveats: 1) That ES gets exactly who he wants. The guy he feels is the best fit, not the best guy who is available now. 2) That we understand and are ok with using the rest of this season to get things straight, whether or not we make the playoffs. 3) That it gets us on the best long-term footing, such as giving ES a solid handle on team needs and personnel moves and avoiding the potential 20-25 game adjustment period next year that you mentioned.
Bski: As always, a well explained, great post. If ES does this with the mindset of your last few points, it’s fine by me, as long as he hires a guy with real experience…I don’t want Dwyane Casey, Alvin Gentry, Brian or Shaw coaching our team, even though I think all three will make nice head coaches eventually (and Casey and Gentry do have two years NBA head coaching experience each).
Mark Jackson is the ONE rookie coach I’d even remotely consider bringing in, solely because he’s a tough ass cookie, and I just think he has the gene to be successful and change a culture. But it’s clear we need a vet that knows what he’s doing, and to me, it’s between Avery or EJ…with Van Gundy on the periphery. Paul Silas would make an interesting out of left field hire, I’m shocked he hasn’t been re-hired yet…but I can’t see ES doing that. And I definitely do NOT want Flip Saunders or the Czar.
Also a little tidbit…I’ve been checking out some podcasts lately on itunes from WIP guys…Howard Eskin, Glen and Anthony, Mike Miscenelli that tend to regularly have Sixers players, coaches and ex players on. Mike M brought Screamin A. Smith in on the day of Mo’s firing, to analyze the team’s situation, Screamin did a nice job breaking things down.
Screamin A Smith comments on interum coach hirings: He felt $$ was a big part of why ES, and other GMs around the league, tend to not hire the new long term guy mid season. Now we have no way of knowing if Screamin A. is right or not, but his logic was basically, “If you just fire a coach that has this year and next on contract, that’s anywhere from $3-7 million a year to pay a guy for no longer coaching your team. You think a GM wants to immediately go out and pay another $3 million for half a season in what most likely is not an ideal coaching gig? They’d far rather shell up a few $100,000 to some interum guy they know won’t be there next season to finish the year out than burn even more cash. While doing so, it gives them a nice opportunity to evaluate the personell and situation of the team.”
Pretty sound logic.
Dave T…..However ES proceeds I’ll tell you one thing that is not sitting well with me: Having bought tickets, making the drive, and going to games all the while knowing that there are a lot of things up in the air, not knowing where it’s all going, and watching a figuring it out, evaluation process instead of a solid basketball team. Not at all what I expected this season to be.
Bski: Ah…but at the very least, when Philly sports get miserable, there are great cheesesteak joints to console us at every opportunity.
Btw I’m curious, are you not local to Philly? Obviously your from the area, but you keep mentioning having to take drives, did you move to Jersey or DE at somepoint? I’m in DC myself, so I know what you mean about when we get the rare opportunity to catch a Sixers/Phillies game in person, wanting it to be a good game with a sound organization behind it.
Dave T…I live just outside of Scranton, PA. It’s a 2 1/2 hour drive into the city for me. I’ve always been a Philly fan. Went to Temple—Go Owls…fight, fight, fight, for the cherry and the white….great win against Tennessee, not so great loss to Kansas—- (School of Pharmacy, class of 1990), which strengthened the bond. I’m tried and true so I don’t mind supporting a work in progress, as long as progress is being made.
As far as DC, my sister-in-law and her family live in Silver Spring, MD. We’ve been in downtown DC a bunch of times, mostly for sightseeing and tourist stuff (Spy Museum, Smithsonian buildings, and such). I’ve caught a decent amount of flak for wearing Philly stuff (Sixers, Phillies), which I do regularly while visiting there.
bski On consideration of your consumer’s grievance, under the legal doctrine of caveat emptor (“let the buyer beware”), the buyer (bski) could not recover from the seller (Philadelphia 76ers) for defects on the property (Wachovia Center) unfit for ordinary purposes (winning) in the absence of
- an express provision in the sale of agreement,
- fraud, or
- a determination that the purchaser purchased something totally
different from that bargined for,
the purchaser is deemed to have acquired the product together with all accompanying defects (Cheeks, Dalembert, Iguodala, et al.) upon conveyance.
But I hear your pain.
Bski: You’re one hell of a fan if you’re driving all the way down from Scranton just to catch a Sixers game, damn! We’re about the same distance from Philly, and you’ve gone to twice more in one year than I have in about ten haha. Ah, nice to see a fellow Temple fan on here. I’ve always been a Temple and St. Joe’s guy, not as much Nova, although I kinda root for them as well. The win over Tenn was huge, and I can’t wait to see the Big 5 game with Nova coming up.
Silver Spring’s a real nice area, I head out that way for some restaurants every now and then. Although, I’m kinda shocked you got flack for wearing Philly gear, for basically two reasons:
1. Washington DC (with the exception of Redskin fans) has quite possibly the crappiest sports fan base in the country. At NBA games, they need to throw Duke symbols on the jumbotron just to get the Maryland area fans to make any kind of noise during Wiz games (not exagerrating) .
2. Probably 1/4 of DC is a combination of NY and Philly sports fans. You have no idea how many green shirts I see around here for the Eagles, and 3-4 years ago I’d say about damn near a third of the jerseys were Iverson’s. By far my favorite thing in DC is to show up at Wizard games, or Nationals or whatever, and have our minority fans bond and out-noise the DC locals.
p.s: I’ve been wanting to buy a Sixers jersey for just that reason, to be an ass to DC people…except I keep going, “Ehhh…do I really want an Iguodala jersey? Or a Brand jersey?” Hopefully they’ll release a Thad Young one soon so I can put on some black and gold again and march through the streets here!
jjg….It’s not that I want my money back. At the risk of sounding like a big-time, free agent athlete….”It’s not about the money, I just want to win a championship.” Really though, I’m ok with progress and I will support that (for a while anyway). Thanks for your Clinton-esque empathy. I appreciate the commiseration.
Dave T….This is the first year we’ve bought tickets for so many games. We usually try to get to 1 game each year (Phillies and Sixers). This year my boys weren’t looking for much for Christmas (imagine that), so we decided to buy a 5-game pack for the family. My boys really enjoy it and my wife is ok with it too (she played ball in high school).
I don’t have a Sixers jersey. I try to stay away from them because of player movement and such. I have a classic, short-sleeve, red Sixers warmup instead (Dannie saw me in my colors at DiLeo’s first game as coach against the Wiz).
I don’t get grief for wearing Philly stuff from people on the street in DC. I usually get moans and groans and some kidding around from employees at the various attractions and restaurants we hit when we go downtown.
I have a confession to make, I have an Iggy jersey and I can!t get myself to put it on.