Comments on: U.S. Men’s Basketball Wins Gold in an Instant Olympic Classic http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/ Philly sports blog for diehard Sixers & Phillies fans Fri, 30 Jul 2010 04:15:56 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Dannie http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4330 Dannie Tue, 26 Aug 2008 17:46:20 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4330 Tsubs - about Kobe one thing you have to remember, although this was a collection of the best players in the world with many guys capable of dominating a game, it's still a team and successful teams have players that know, accept and play their roles to perfection.  LeBron James has said all Olympics that Kobe was the guy willing and capable to take over a game in the clutch if things were not going well.  They never had to deal with that proposition or allocate that role until the Gold medal game.  Wade's role was the spark off the bench.  LeBron was the versatile all-around forward who dominated the interior and weak side defense.  Kobe was the perimeter defensive stopper.  But with the game on the line I think everyone on that team as well as the coaching staff knew who the go-to guy would be and that's Kobe. You said his team deferred to him as if that was a bad thing.  I argue it's mandatory in order for teams to be successful.  If you have too many guys trying to "prove his own mettle" you have no "team."  They deferred because they accepted Kobe as the dominant offensive player in that situation and they simply filled other roles i.e. offense rebound, catch and shoot, set screens etc.)  Kobe came through in a big way.  He made the right pass and took the right shots in the fourth quarter.  That's why he is the best player.  Like Pete said, he took some bad shots all through the Olympics but in the clutch he was nearly flawless <em>(only mistake was playing terrible, reaching from behind defense on Fernandez which led to him dunking on Dwight Howard)</em>.  Besides that he was perfect. Tsubs – about Kobe one thing you have to remember, although this was a collection of the best players in the world with many guys capable of dominating a game, it’s still a team and successful teams have players that know, accept and play their roles to perfection. 

LeBron James has said all Olympics that Kobe was the guy willing and capable to take over a game in the clutch if things were not going well.  They never had to deal with that proposition or allocate that role until the Gold medal game. 

Wade’s role was the spark off the bench.  LeBron was the versatile all-around forward who dominated the interior and weak side defense.  Kobe was the perimeter defensive stopper.  But with the game on the line I think everyone on that team as well as the coaching staff knew who the go-to guy would be and that’s Kobe.

You said his team deferred to him as if that was a bad thing.  I argue it’s mandatory in order for teams to be successful.  If you have too many guys trying to “prove his own mettle” you have no “team.”  They deferred because they accepted Kobe as the dominant offensive player in that situation and they simply filled other roles i.e. offense rebound, catch and shoot, set screens etc.) 

Kobe came through in a big way.  He made the right pass and took the right shots in the fourth quarter.  That’s why he is the best player.  Like Pete said, he took some bad shots all through the Olympics but in the clutch he was nearly flawless (only mistake was playing terrible, reaching from behind defense on Fernandez which led to him dunking on Dwight Howard).  Besides that he was perfect.

]]> By: tsubs http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4325 tsubs Tue, 26 Aug 2008 15:59:43 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4325 Do you guys think it would have been different had Manu not been injured during the semis? Good point about Chris Paul not being as effective as he was in the NBA with Chandler.  He holds on to the ball a little too long for international play, and the defense just stays on that  zone so, as it was pointed out, CP had to reset several times. Am still not convinced about Bryant being the dominant player during the clutch, though.  It seemed to me his teammates just deferred to him.  Also, the fact that he dominated the clutch means he was hogging the ball at this time (anent, it may be argued he rightfully did).  It just meant that since KB was dominating, no other teammate could prove his own mettle at that time.  I believe there were at least two others in the team who are on a par with KB, particularly Wade and James. I look forward to the next International Championships.  I agree with the opinion that the USA will not be as dominant.  I like it that way.  Just good, healthy basketball for everyone to see and admire, regardless of which team anyone may be cheering for. Thanks for the posts, guys. Very interesting and insightful. Do you guys think it would have been different had Manu not been injured during the semis?

Good point about Chris Paul not being as effective as he was in the NBA with Chandler.  He holds on to the ball a little too long for international play, and the defense just stays on that  zone so, as it was pointed out, CP had to reset several times.

Am still not convinced about Bryant being the dominant player during the clutch, though.  It seemed to me his teammates just deferred to him.  Also, the fact that he dominated the clutch means he was hogging the ball at this time (anent, it may be argued he rightfully did).  It just meant that since KB was dominating, no other teammate could prove his own mettle at that time.  I believe there were at least two others in the team who are on a par with KB, particularly Wade and James.

I look forward to the next International Championships.  I agree with the opinion that the USA will not be as dominant.  I like it that way.  Just good, healthy basketball for everyone to see and admire, regardless of which team anyone may be cheering for.

Thanks for the posts, guys. Very interesting and insightful.

]]> By: Dannie http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4285 Dannie Mon, 25 Aug 2008 01:15:20 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4285 Blazers should be unbelievable with the glut of talent they have at such a young age and more draft picks than they can use in the coming years as well.  I think Bayless could be interchangeable with Monta Ellis but I prefer the better perimeter shooter.  Now that I think of Eric Gordon could be a shooter on that team as well.  And I think Brandon Rush could be a good role player guy as well.  Do we think no other veterans would want to play? That team would have trouble with this Spain team for sure, but they have the luxury of playing against a 32-year old Gasol vs. the 28-year version we just faced.  And I have no idea how good any of the young U.S. players well end up being.  Oden could be the best big man in the world or a one-dimensional defensive player. Pete you don't think Deron Williams will want to play again? Blazers should be unbelievable with the glut of talent they have at such a young age and more draft picks than they can use in the coming years as well.  I think Bayless could be interchangeable with Monta Ellis but I prefer the better perimeter shooter.  Now that I think of Eric Gordon could be a shooter on that team as well.  And I think Brandon Rush could be a good role player guy as well.  Do we think no other veterans would want to play?

That team would have trouble with this Spain team for sure, but they have the luxury of playing against a 32-year old Gasol vs. the 28-year version we just faced. 

And I have no idea how good any of the young U.S. players well end up being.  Oden could be the best big man in the world or a one-dimensional defensive player.

Pete you don’t think Deron Williams will want to play again?

]]> By: Jordan http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4281 Jordan Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:15:46 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4281 Dannie's team has 3 Blazers, not to mention Rudy will probably be the star of Spain by 2012. They're going to be scary. Dannie’s team has 3 Blazers, not to mention Rudy will probably be the star of Spain by 2012.

They’re going to be scary.

]]> By: Pete http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4280 Pete Sun, 24 Aug 2008 23:03:40 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4280 whoops, I forgot Greg Oden. He can replace Horford.  <div> </div> <div>and for what its worth. I think that team would have trouble with Spain. </div> whoops, I forgot Greg Oden. He can replace Horford. 

and for what its worth. I think that team would have trouble with Spain. 
]]> By: Dannie http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4274 Dannie Sun, 24 Aug 2008 18:37:50 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4274 Kobe took a couple bad shots in almost every game during the Olympics as well as Melo.  His defense was fantastic most of the time, but offensively he settled for threes entirely too much and didn't post up enough.  I agree Bosh was the surprise player of the tournament for Team USA.  He was amazing at everything he did.  Without his fantastic pick and roll defense  and FT shooting team USA would have been in trouble. I think Marc Gasol is going to have a hard time staying out of foul trouble in the NBA.  But, with the additional space he will have to work with in the post he should be effective on offense in the post. Pete I initially thought the same thing about Chris Paul.  But then I thought more about it and I think he was smart not to penetrate like he does in the NBA.  He dominates the ball and dribbles around a lot.  He loves to get in the lane and dribble around in that box for 2.5 seconds then make the lob to Chandler to go to the hole.  That works perfectly in the NBA because the rules keep the lane more open for him to maneuver in there.  When I saw was him try to do that, instead of seeing a terrified NBA big man unsure of how to play the situation he had 3 dudes forming a triangle around him and he ended up just backing it out to reset.  He also tried the lob to Howard on a few occasions and they just weren't in sync at all - lobs right on point but Howard not even jumping for them unaware that the ball was even coming. As for Howard I just think his post game isn't advanced enough (yet) to deal with less time to make an offensive decision and less space to work with. <strong>My 2012 Starters </strong>(not different from Pete's)<strong>:</strong> <ul> <li>Chris Paul - PG </li> <li>O.J. Mayo - SG</li> <li>Kevin Durant - SF </li> <li>Michael Beasley - PF</li> <li>Dwight Howard - C </li> </ul> <strong>Reserves: </strong> <ul> <li>Deron Williams - PG </li> <li>Brandon Roy - SG </li> <li>Andre Iguodala - SF</li> <li>Chris Bosh - PF</li> <li>Greg Oden - C </li> <li>Jerryd Bayless - G </li> <li> Thaddeus Young (aka 2012 Tayshaun Prince) - F</li> </ul> Kobe took a couple bad shots in almost every game during the Olympics as well as Melo.  His defense was fantastic most of the time, but offensively he settled for threes entirely too much and didn’t post up enough. 

I agree Bosh was the surprise player of the tournament for Team USA.  He was amazing at everything he did.  Without his fantastic pick and roll defense  and FT shooting team USA would have been in trouble.

I think Marc Gasol is going to have a hard time staying out of foul trouble in the NBA.  But, with the additional space he will have to work with in the post he should be effective on offense in the post.

Pete I initially thought the same thing about Chris Paul.  But then I thought more about it and I think he was smart not to penetrate like he does in the NBA.  He dominates the ball and dribbles around a lot.  He loves to get in the lane and dribble around in that box for 2.5 seconds then make the lob to Chandler to go to the hole.  That works perfectly in the NBA because the rules keep the lane more open for him to maneuver in there.  When I saw was him try to do that, instead of seeing a terrified NBA big man unsure of how to play the situation he had 3 dudes forming a triangle around him and he ended up just backing it out to reset.  He also tried the lob to Howard on a few occasions and they just weren’t in sync at all – lobs right on point but Howard not even jumping for them unaware that the ball was even coming.

As for Howard I just think his post game isn’t advanced enough (yet) to deal with less time to make an offensive decision and less space to work with.

My 2012 Starters (not different from Pete’s):

  • Chris Paul – PG
  • O.J. Mayo – SG
  • Kevin Durant – SF
  • Michael Beasley – PF
  • Dwight Howard – C

Reserves:

  • Deron Williams – PG
  • Brandon Roy – SG
  • Andre Iguodala – SF
  • Chris Bosh – PF
  • Greg Oden – C
  • Jerryd Bayless – G
  • Thaddeus Young (aka 2012 Tayshaun Prince) – F
]]> By: Pete http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4266 Pete Sun, 24 Aug 2008 16:24:58 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4266 I didn't stay up, I went to sleep from 12-230, and then got up. Much better strategy.  <div> </div> <div>It was a truly great game. A couple things to add to what dannie said. </div> <div> </div> <div>- Yes, Kobe made some HUGE shots at the end, but he also took 2-3 horrible shots leading up to it. That being said, I don't think they would have beat Spain this morning without him. </div> <div> </div> <div>- Chris Bosh was fantastic throughout the olympics and looks like he could be poised for a leap this year if he plays with the intensity (led team in Rebounds) he did during the games. He played so well he essentially benched Carlos Boozer during the games. </div> <div> </div> <div>- At the end of the game, and while they attended the other events, it was great to watch these grown men acting like excited little kids. Michael Redd nearly had a heart attack, Kobe was hugging everyone he could find, and Coach K had a "I can't really go back to coaching Greg Paulus, can I?" face on. </div> <div> </div> <div>- Ricky Rubio is going to be a very good NBA player. He has rare vision and poise, and great hands and instincts (2nd in STL/40 minutes behind only Dwayne Wade among teams that made the medal round). The most amazing thing as you are watching him calmly bring the ball up and throwing a one-handed zip-pass to a wide open 3 point shooter in the biggest game in his country's history? He's SEVENTEEN. No player, except LeBron, could have played in a game like this for the U.S. at that age. I can't wait to see him in the NBA. </div> <div> </div> <div>- Rudy Fernandez was unreal, as Dannie said. You HAVE to see that dunk on Dwight Howard (after shaking Kobe, by the way). Dannie is right that he won't be able to chuck up the 3's he was in the NBA, BUT - his reckless, aggressive, all-around game reminds me A LOT of Manu Ginobili. </div> <div> </div> <div>- Final Spain thoughts - It's a shame that Navarro went back over seas, he's a very exciting player. I'm not sure how Marc Gasol will be in the NBA, he's HUGE and will be solid, but I think the Grizz are expecting a lot more from him. </div> <div> </div> <div>- Throughout the whole tournament, I wanted to see Chris Paul penetrate more. He seemed hesitant to assert himself offensively with the bigger "names" on the team. Also wanted to see Dwight Howard dominate down low a little more. </div> <div> </div> <div>- Who's on the 2012 team? I've heard that James, Bryant, Wade and Melo are likely out, and that Paul and Howard have said they are in. This isn't something where we get our gold this year, and then mail it in again 2012. We HAVE to keep winning, and it's just going to get harder and harder and international teams gain depth (this might be the last dominant, winning by 20+ every game, US squad we see). Based on the select team, here is my best guess at the 2012 roster (with their ages in 2012). Give it your best shot as well. </div> <div> </div> <div>PG- Chris Paul, 27</div> <div>SG- O.J. Mayo, 24</div> <div>SF-  Kevin Durant, 24</div> <div>PF-  Michael Beasley, 23</div> <div>C-  Dwight Howard, 26</div> <div> </div> <div>Bench: </div> <div>Derrick Rose, 23</div> <div>Brandon Roy, 28 </div> <div>Andre Iguodala, 28</div> <div>Josh Smith, 26</div> <div>Kevin Love, 23</div> <div>Al Horford, 26</div> <div>John Wall, 21</div> <div> </div> I didn’t stay up, I went to sleep from 12-230, and then got up. Much better strategy. 

It was a truly great game. A couple things to add to what dannie said. 
- Yes, Kobe made some HUGE shots at the end, but he also took 2-3 horrible shots leading up to it. That being said, I don’t think they would have beat Spain this morning without him. 
- Chris Bosh was fantastic throughout the olympics and looks like he could be poised for a leap this year if he plays with the intensity (led team in Rebounds) he did during the games. He played so well he essentially benched Carlos Boozer during the games. 
- At the end of the game, and while they attended the other events, it was great to watch these grown men acting like excited little kids. Michael Redd nearly had a heart attack, Kobe was hugging everyone he could find, and Coach K had a “I can’t really go back to coaching Greg Paulus, can I?” face on. 
- Ricky Rubio is going to be a very good NBA player. He has rare vision and poise, and great hands and instincts (2nd in STL/40 minutes behind only Dwayne Wade among teams that made the medal round). The most amazing thing as you are watching him calmly bring the ball up and throwing a one-handed zip-pass to a wide open 3 point shooter in the biggest game in his country’s history? He’s SEVENTEEN. No player, except LeBron, could have played in a game like this for the U.S. at that age. I can’t wait to see him in the NBA. 
- Rudy Fernandez was unreal, as Dannie said. You HAVE to see that dunk on Dwight Howard (after shaking Kobe, by the way). Dannie is right that he won’t be able to chuck up the 3’s he was in the NBA, BUT – his reckless, aggressive, all-around game reminds me A LOT of Manu Ginobili. 
- Final Spain thoughts – It’s a shame that Navarro went back over seas, he’s a very exciting player. I’m not sure how Marc Gasol will be in the NBA, he’s HUGE and will be solid, but I think the Grizz are expecting a lot more from him. 
- Throughout the whole tournament, I wanted to see Chris Paul penetrate more. He seemed hesitant to assert himself offensively with the bigger “names” on the team. Also wanted to see Dwight Howard dominate down low a little more. 
- Who’s on the 2012 team? I’ve heard that James, Bryant, Wade and Melo are likely out, and that Paul and Howard have said they are in. This isn’t something where we get our gold this year, and then mail it in again 2012. We HAVE to keep winning, and it’s just going to get harder and harder and international teams gain depth (this might be the last dominant, winning by 20+ every game, US squad we see). Based on the select team, here is my best guess at the 2012 roster (with their ages in 2012). Give it your best shot as well. 
PG- Chris Paul, 27
SG- O.J. Mayo, 24
SF-  Kevin Durant, 24
PF-  Michael Beasley, 23
C-  Dwight Howard, 26
Bench: 
Derrick Rose, 23
Brandon Roy, 28 
Andre Iguodala, 28
Josh Smith, 26
Kevin Love, 23
Al Horford, 26
John Wall, 21
]]> By: bski http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4264 bski Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:39:44 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4264 <strong>Dannie</strong>...Thanks a lot for the recap. <em> No way</em> I could stay up to watch it.  It's great to see basketball around the world develop to the point where we have no choice but to practice, play, and develop <em>as a team</em> in order to win the gold.  Like Suede said, hopefully they <em>get it</em> and now fully understand the dedication required.  The best part is, it will just continue to raise the level of the game, which is great for us fans. Dannie…Thanks a lot for the recap.  No way I could stay up to watch it.  It’s great to see basketball around the world develop to the point where we have no choice but to practice, play, and develop as a team in order to win the gold.  Like Suede said, hopefully they get it and now fully understand the dedication required.  The best part is, it will just continue to raise the level of the game, which is great for us fans.

]]> By: deepsixersuede http://www.reclinergm.com/us-mens-basketball-wins-gold-in-an-instant-olympic-classic/#comment-4263 deepsixersuede Sun, 24 Aug 2008 13:13:37 +0000 http://www.reclinergm.com/?p=499#comment-4263 Dannie, again you show your dedication; planned on staying up but had too many beers. Good to be back as a basketball power, maybe they finally get it. Fernandez, the little I!ve seen seems to bring a D.Collins like frenetic energy to the court, always moving. Hopefully one of ours gets to play in a few years [Iggy,Thad ?]. Dannie, again you show your dedication; planned on staying up but had too many beers. Good to be back as a basketball power, maybe they finally get it. Fernandez, the little I!ve seen seems to bring a D.Collins like frenetic energy to the court, always moving. Hopefully one of ours gets to play in a few years [Iggy,Thad ?].

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