World Series Game 4 Chat

So far for the weekend festivities, PHL leads 2-1.  Now the stage the set for Game 4!  GO JOE.  If the Phils win tonight, I feel like Cliff Lee will take care of business tomorrow and then it will be 3-2.  Game 4 is a must win!

Can someone explain how a Ibanez got an error?  The throw was technically a perfect one hopper.  Damon just slide out in front of the baseline.

howard is stinking but they are throwing him some tough pitches too.  They are pitching him really well.

Does Howard or Ibanez even have a swing to hit that slider that’s a strike on the outside corner?  I mean it doesn’t look like their bat can make contact with it even if they were on it.

Perfect inning Joe.  Don’t let the bottom of that lineup hurt us.

If it makes you feel any better Pete, I had a buddy at game 1 and he said there were quite a few Phills fans there.  He also said the Yankee fans felt more like customers than fans….lotta people not paying attention to the game.  I don’t know if it was where he was sitting or what….

Did anyone here know that Blanton has struggled against the Yankees in his career?  I for one heard, but I forgot and thankfully Joe Buck reminded me, again.

Dude get fucking consistent with the high strikes.  Call them both ways.

Yea, I have heard that too – of course Sox fans haven’t forgiven Buck and McCarver since 2004 either.  I am not sure if I think they hate the Phills – I just find them annoying.  Every time Utley has come up today, Buck has gone over 2-3 times that Utley hit two HRs off of Sabathia in game 1.

umps are keeping us in it.  Blanton had to have a big zone to keep us in it.

Phillyfan – Dude give me a break.

our offense is either gone into one of its week long funks or we are starting to feel the pressure.

Good shit Pedro and Ryan.

Did Utley actually think that would work?

Where is Chase’s head with these glove flips?  He definitely had the time to get the lead runner.  He should get an error.

this is painful – two lazy hits.  Yankees just have the magic this year folks.

Jeter and Damon’s hits weren’t even that hard

it is so obvious.  Blanton loses the bite on his curve after 50 pitches.  It flattens out and that is why he gets hit.  Boy he got away with that one to A-rod.

He got quick pitched and his timing was off on his routine.  Great at-bat Chase.

wow – CC is the man

Correct me if I am wrong, but a bench player has not gotten a hit this series, have they?

Excuse me…this postseason…?

their softly hit balls are base hits and our hard hit balls are going right to their fielders….

That’s how you know Ryan isn’t right.  He can’t even hit fastballs right now.

Come on with the walks to extend innings.

Ok we are into their bullpen at a meaningful part of the game NOT against Rivera.  This is it.  This is the comeback that swings the series for us.

YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHh

WTF

OMG

Unbelievable.  Scared to throw the slider.

Cole Hamels and Brad Lidge.  Won us one and have put us in a really big hole in the next.

I cannot fucking believe there was NO ONE THERE AT FUCKING THIRD BASE so that Johnny Damon could fucking WALK his way to stolen base number two.  What a !@#$ing meltdown, are you @!#$ing kidding me?  What the @!#$.  Need a walk.

Down 3-1.  This is what happens when you can’t string together hits.  In the 4th Rollins and Victorino get on with no outs and we come away with nothing.  Meanwhile Utley and Feliz both knock solo shots.  This team can hit, just not in bunches right now, which is kind of the reason they are in the WS.  Just remember the ‘79 Pirates.  We are Family.  And tomorrow we are Fam-i-LEE (sorry, couldn’t resist).  The 79 Pirates came back from 3-1 by winning three straight on the road, Phillies just need 2 on the road.  It ain’t over yet!!

The 79 Pirates faced an Orioles club with a closer named Don Stanhouse.  His nickname was “Full Pack.”  Drove Earl Weaver to a pack a game cigarette habit with his Lidgesque tendencies.  Comparisons between Stanhouse and Rivera are imagination based.

But this series is not over until the Phillies give up.  There is no chance of that.

I assure you that despite the sports radio and internet message boards exposing silliness amongst fans and media who have favored whichever club won the most recent game to win the series, this remains a battle of 2 championship level clubs who know how far there is to go.  Things can change in a split second.

Sabathia has now won (although Joba got the W) on 3 days rest.  Burnet (versus Lee) and Petite haven’t.  That’s room for hope.  Plus, Sabathia will probably b more beatable off the repeat short rest starts.

We’ve seen some ridiculous offensive slumps by the Phils before.  Hell, 10-48 when scoring 3 or less oughta tell you how frequently they didn’t hit.  Nobody says it will be easy to start mashing the ball against these pitchers, short rest or not, but they don’t schedule these things.

My biggest concern for Game 5 is that the Yanks were able to make adjustments after seeing video of Cliff in game 1.  Hopefully they haven’t.
 
There is still a long way to go.   Everyone knows about the Red Sox in 04 off a 19-8 drubbing in LCS Game 3.  But what is not well known is that prior to Game 4, when the teams were taking batting practive, some of the Red Sox players were congratulating the Yankees and wishing them well in the Series.  And the Red Sox still won.

Do not disrespect the field of athletic competion or the character of the Phillies.   The Yanks may win in 5, but no matter how much you hear its over tomorrow, it’s not.  Not by a long shot.

I have a few questions/thoughts.

1. Why with the shift on didn’t we have Feliz in position where he doesn’t have to take a throw on a steal attempt?  Put Jimmy there.  Every other team does it (the Dodger for example did it with Blake against us multiple times).  First off I think that might have caused Damon to AT LEAST hesitate to try and out run Jimmy to third.  And if he got bold and tried I think Jimmy catches him.
2. Why doesn’t the manager/catcher/leader/SOMEONE come huddle the infield together and discuss the possibility of a steal attempt and how they will handle it? i.e. no throw, Lidge MUST get to third, etc etc.
3. After the steal, steal by Damon and then Texeria gets hit WHY IN THE HELL didn’t Dubee make a trip out to the mound before facing A-Rod? Did he? Maybe I missed it while my face was firmly planted in my hands. At the very least to give him a minute, let him calm down.  But more so to talk about how they want to attack him here (aka don’t hesitate or be afraid to throw the slider).
4. Tale of the last two games – getting beat not throwing our best pitch.  A-Rod hasn’t made contact on anything off-speed and away NOTHING.  So we throw him an inside fastball that he graciously let get called for a strike.  Then we come right back with one up and right down the pipe.  The approaches to hitters by Cole and Lidge when the pressure was on is a freakin’ joke.  Again they both had their stuff.  Hell Lidge’s slider looked beautiful.  They just completely forget HOW to pitch when the situation gets tense.  If A-Rod hits a great slide for a base hit – so beit.  And there should have been absolutely NO cause for concern about a past ball with Chooch back there.
5. Finally, my photographic memory isn’t working right now does anyone recall if on the 1-0 pitch Lidge shook anything off?  I just want to know if Ruiz called the fastball or if Lidge shook off the Slider.  AND if Lidge did shake off the slider I think it’s Ruiz’s responsibility to make a trip to the mound.

F’ing bullshit.

our excellent defense hasn’t really been much of a factor this series

I think after last night’s game it has.  Sadly in a negative way.  Two plays defensively resulted in runs in a game that was 4-4 in the ninth.

Like I said yesterday, congrats on your title last season.  Congrats on your winning the national league this year.  But you ran into the wrong fucking New York team, this isn’t the puzzy Mets, this is a team of hall of famers that will outplay you, outwork you,  and out think you.

Sorry I couldn’t join the chat the last two games.
 
I was thinking the same thing about Lidge getting away from throwing his slider.  He had just struck out Jeter on a beauty, then he kept throwing one fastball after another to Damon.  He got ahead of Damon 1-2 and proceeded to throw him 5 straight fastballs (2 consecutive balls, 2 consecutive fouls, then the hit).  After the first foul I was saying to my wife that he needs to get away from the fastball.  After the second foul I KNEW he needed to stop throwing it to Damon.  He kept throwing it though.
 
Every single thing the Yankees got off Lidge——–Damon’s single, Teixeira’s HBP, A-Rod’s double, and Posada’s single——–they got off his fastball. For the life of me I can’t understand why he kept throwing it.
 
The other thing I didn’t agree with was Manuel leaving Lidge in the game after A-Rod’s double.  At the time I said to my wife, again, that we can’t take the chance of Lidge giving up another hit because it would put us in a 3-run hole and give us almost no chance to come back against Rivera.  Don’t know what Charlie’s reasoning was (I haven’t read any of the papers yet), but I thought it was a big mistake at the time.
 
 
 

it aint over yet, all we need is one game where everything goes our way. that’ll get ‘em rolling.
 
so many things to blame game 4 loss on, but its past, why even bother anymore.

Our resilience and one-game-at-a-time focus will really be put to the test now, but you’re right, Chris, having Lee on the mound tonight against a short-rest Burnett will help a lot.  We’ll also get a short-rest Pettitte in game 6 and a double-short-rest Sabathia in game 7, so this is doable. 

Last night was really a rip-your-heart-out loss though.  I keep going over it.  The third thing I thought after Feliz hit the homerun to tie it——–the first was I can’t believe he did it, the second was why would Chamberlain throw him a fastball——–was that the top of our order would now get a shot to win it in the bottom of the 9th against everyone else in the Yankees pen and avoid Rivera.  Ugh.

I totally agree bski.  There was very little doubt in my mind that the Phills would get a run even if the Yanks threw Rivera out there.  You can play small ball against Mo, because he does not hold runners on, and he pitches to contact.  I was even more confident when Lidge was 1-2 on Damon.  Very tough to stomach.
 
 
However, they have been written off – and at least for tonight, they can play lose in front of their home crowd with their ace on the mound.  I am at least going to try and enjoy the game tonight.  I hope they do too, certainly play better when they are having fun.

Looking ahead, the biggest issue the Phils face is what to do with Rollins in this lineup.   He is a leadoff hitter that doesn’t get on base.  It would be nice to bring in a real leadoff hitter.  The PROBLEM though is Rollins is a spotlight kind of guy and he isn’t that old.  He has had some clutch hits and I think he sees himself as a out-front leader.  Dropping him to the 7th hole would be a big shot to his ego and he is the only player on the team that may mess with the chemistry.

pg,

When Lidge got to 1-2 on Damon, I was confident too.  I found this quote from Damon in Jayson Stark’s article on game 4:

“I kept chasing that slider down, and I was able to force it to 3-2, and then I kept sitting slider, and he kept throwing the fastball. They really don’t teach you to do it that way. They normally always tell you to look fastball because if you sit slider, it would be too tough to catch up to a fastball. But I felt like his slider made me look silly on a couple pitches. So I kept sitting slider and just reacted to the fastball.”

Sounds to me like Damon was as surprised as I was to see all those fastballs.  Now, it’s entirely possible that, since he was sitting on it,  he would have gotten a hit had Lidge thrown him a slider.  Were I Lidge, I’d certainly had taken my chances though. 

First, Damon admits, and we saw, that he chased the slider.  Second, Matsui and Jeter had done it before him, so Lidge had to know he was throwing it well and having success with the pitch.   Third, Damon fouled off two consecutive fastballs and looked, at least to me, like he was getting on the pitch.  Just baffling to me that he would get away from his slider and stay away from it for the rest of the inning, especially since he was getting hurt on his fastball.

Ken,

Removing Lidge never occured to you?  Was it just me then?  Did anyone else think that Charlie should have pulled him at any point?

Honestly, after my initial anger at Lidge for giving up the go-ahead run on a fastball subsided, I immediately wanted Charlie to yank Lidge.  I was very concerned that he was losing it when he hit Tex, but after the double I really felt like he had lost his focus and/or confidence and we were in danger of having the game get away from us.  I was thinking to bring Eyre in to get Posada and keep it a 1-run game, giving us a shot against Rivera.